meta_pixel
Tapesearch Logo
Log in
The Story

The Wuhan lab (Pt 2): The shadow project

The Story

The Times

News Analysis, In-depth Journalism, Uk News, Investigative Reporting, News, Audio Storytelling, Current Affairs, Global News, Politics, Daily News, Long-form Audio, Daily News Podcast, Exclusive Interviews

3.91.6K Ratings

🗓️ 30 June 2023

⏱️ 39 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

The second of our two-part special on the origins of Covid, drawing from a new Sunday Times investigation into the Wuhan Institute of Virology.

The Insight team has spoken to US investigators who believe the Wuhan Institute ran a covert project of dangerous experiments – and that it was done in collaboration with the Chinese military.

This podcast was brought to you thanks to the support of readers of The Times and The Sunday Times. Subscribe today: thetimes.co.uk/storiesofourtimes. 

Guests:

- Jonathan Calvert, Insight Editor, The Sunday Times.

- George Arbuthnott, Deputy Insight Editor, The Sunday Times.

Host: Manveen Rana.

Clips: Channel 4 News, CNA 3, NBC News, EWTN.

This podcast was brought to you thanks to subscribers of The Times and The Sunday Times. To enjoy unlimited digital access to all our journalism subscribe here.


Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

Yesterday, in part one, the Sunday Times Insight team, Jonathan Calvert, and George

0:11.6

Abarthnot, explained how they found themselves challenging the prevailing wisdom about how

0:19.3

the pandemic began.

0:21.5

The hotspot in the first few weeks of the outbreak was right next to the laboratories in Wuhan

0:28.2

and not next to the market.

0:31.1

When we started looking at it, the actual evidence for our natural origin was surprisingly

0:36.2

weak.

0:37.2

It seemed to us that the weights of the circumstantial evidence strongly pointed to the lab.

0:43.7

And how research at the Wuhan Institute in the run-up to the pandemic seemed to have taken

0:49.8

a risky turn.

0:51.9

Exactly the steps that they were needed to be taken to create COVID-19 in the lab.

0:58.1

They were being carried out.

1:00.4

They were doing a type of experiment where they were fusing together viruses and they

1:03.8

did not know what was going to happen.

1:06.4

They were creating something in their lab which was in effect a monster.

1:14.1

But according to the Insight team's reporting, that might not have been the only work going

1:19.5

on at the Wuhan Institute.

1:25.7

Now listening to stories of our times from the times and the Sunday times, I'm Manvin

1:30.8

Rana.

1:31.8

Today, the second episode in our two-part special on the origins of COVID.

1:38.7

Part two, a shadow project at the Wuhan lab.

1:55.7

In part one, we heard how controversial gain-of-function techniques developed by American

...

Please login to see the full transcript.

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from The Times, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of The Times and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.

Copyright © Tapesearch 2026.