Hi everyone, welcome to the A6 and Z podcast. I'm Sonal. Today's episode was recorded at our most recent

annual innovation summit in our pop-up podcast booth with me and Kevin Kelly, founding executive

editor of Wired Magazine and author of several books. In this quick, literally hallway style chat,

I asked him about two of his big ideas, the notion of 1,000 true fans, which sometimes

people misinterpret or miss the nuances of, and two, the idea of being able to sell our own

attention versus our attention being sold for very little. And we try to connect the dots between

these and other ideas, including some new never been heard before ones in between. The second

idea was also covered in his most

recent book, The Inevitable, which we did a podcast on with Chris Dixon and his conversation with Mark

at this summit is also available in this feed as well. Welcome, Kevin. It's a real delight

to be here. Thanks for having me. I think of you as one of the original thinkers of the future.

We're just coming off of Summit. One of the big themes was about the future of business models after advertising. This is a talk

Connie gave last year and then today she went further on that, like what happens when things

become a super app. We had Kevin Chu from Forte talking about business models for crypto economics

and gaming. And then we had Jonah Peretti and Chris Dixon talking about the evolution of the web

and how so much of the promise of the web in some ways came about,

but in other ways didn't because of the sort of albatross around our neck of advertising.

It's a business model.

So one idea I remember you talking about in your book that just blew me out of the water.

It was so interesting.

Like it was a Kevin Kelly signature idea.

Is this idea that you can actually, in the future, we may be able to, quote, reverse our attention economy.

...