Pushkin.

It's hard to read the news these days without asking yourself, how did we get here?

Fiasco is a history podcast for the co-creators of Slow Burn.

In our first season, Bush v. Gore, we examined an unmistakable turning point in American

politics, the 2000 election, which resulted in a high-stakes stalemate, ended with one of the most

controversial rulings in Supreme Court history. So if you're trying to make sense at the present

moment, check out Fiasco, Bush v. Gore. Listen on theHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

From Pushkin Industries, this is deep background, the show where we explore the stories behind the stories in the news.

I'm Noah Feldman. As states begin to reopen, we're all desperately trying to figure out what is going to happen next.

What are the possible courses of COVID-19?

What are the possible outcomes if there is a vaccine?

And what are the possibilities if indeed we don't get a vaccine or a therapeutic treatment that actually changes things?

Joining me to discuss these issues is Dr. Yonatan Graad.

He's an assistant professor in the Department of Immunology and Infectious Diseases at the Harvard

Chan School of Public Health.

He's also an attending physician in the Division of Infectious Diseases at Brigham and Women's

Hospital and Harvard Medical School.

Yonatan, thank you so much for being here.

I really hugely appreciate it.

And the first topic I want to ask you about is a paper on which you're one of the co-authors

that was published in Science Magazine that is a model or a series of models,

among other things of what could happen under conditions of reopening

...