Welcome to Karen Hunter is awesome. I am Karen Hunter, and in this space, I love speaking with

amazing people about amazing topics. And today, Dr. Daniel Black joins me to talk about

the science of evil, the new book by Simon

Barron Cohen, where he explores whether evil is inherent or is it learned. Can we teach empathy,

which is where I wanted to go today with Dr. Daniel Black. Can we build more empathy is the question. Stay tuned.

I wanted to start in a different place. So I'm walking this morning and I'm listening to this book,

The Science of Evil. Okay. On empathy and the origins of cruelty. Somebody recommended it.

I think it was Joe Christian Gill. And it's by Simon Baron Cohen. If the name sounds familiar, his cousin, Sasha Baron Cohen. So at first I wasn't going to pick up the book because I think his cousin is problematic. Okay. And so I was going to hold him responsible for that as if, but this is what we do, right? What I want to talk to you about because, you know, we tend to the sins of the father, et cetera, et cetera.

Right. So like if I'm black and I've had a bad experience with white people, all white people. If I'm white and I've been conditioned to think of Mexicans or black people, all black people. Right. So I was like, I don't need to read this book because I don't have, you know, I have empathy.

But I was like, I don't need to read this book because I don't have, you know, I have empathy. But I was like, I'm going for my walk. Let me listen. So, you know, I made a conscious

decision that novels I'm going to read this year, novels and things that I need to penetrate my soul.

Absolutely. I'm going to physically read. And stuff that I need

for information that I'm going to share with people, I can listen to. So this is something I

decided to listen to. So in the first chapter, he talks about Nazi Germany. He talks about

the cruelty. He was Jewish and he had a friend whose grandmother was in the Holocaust.

And when he met her, her hands were on opposite arms.

In the concentration camp, Mangala, they had experimented on Jewish people.

And one of the experiments they did was they took her hands off and sold them on the opposite arm.

And to this day. but that's not it.

You know, another friend of his, his grandfather talked about being in the camp with Mangala and his father told him to stay near the barn so he doesn't get near the shed so he doesn't

get snatched up in these experiments. But they experimented scientists, brilliant people on human beings. And they

put them in, you know, we know now how to rescue people from the cold because of the experiments

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