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Witness History

The Schengen Agreement

Witness History

BBC

History, Personal Journals, Society & Culture

4.41.6K Ratings

🗓️ 13 June 2025

⏱️ 11 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

On 14 June 1985, five politicians met on a boat in the town of Schengen, in Luxembourg, to sign an agreement to get rid of border checks between their countries: Belgium, the Netherlands, Luxembourg, France and West Germany.

The Schengen Area now encompasses more than 450 million people and 29 countries in Europe.

Rachel Naylor speaks to Robert Goebbels, who was Luxembourg’s Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, and one of the original five signatories.

Eye-witness accounts brought to life by archive. Witness History is for those fascinated by the past. We take you to the events that have shaped our world through the eyes of the people who were there. For nine minutes every day, we take you back in time and all over the world, to examine wars, coups, scientific discoveries, cultural moments and much more.

Recent episodes explore everything from football in Brazil, the history of the ‘Indian Titanic’ and the invention of air fryers, to Public Enemy’s Fight The Power, subway art and the political crisis in Georgia. We look at the lives of some of the most famous leaders, artists, scientists and personalities in history, including: visionary architect Antoni Gaudi and the design of the Sagrada Familia; Michael Jordan and his bespoke Nike trainers; Princess Diana at the Taj Mahal; and Görel Hanser, manager of legendary Swedish pop band Abba on the influence they’ve had on the music industry. You can learn all about fascinating and surprising stories, such as the time an Iraqi journalist hurled his shoes at the President of the United States in protest of America’s occupation of Iraq; the creation of the Hollywood commercial that changed advertising forever; and the ascent of the first Aboriginal MP.

(Photo: Catherine Lalumière from France signs the Schengen Agreement, with Robert Goebbels next to her, on the left. Credit: Marcel Mochet / AFP via Getty Images)

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

Why does some big successful brands go bust?

0:05.7

Toast is back for a new series, taking a look at the decisions that often left investors burnt.

0:11.6

I'm Sean Farrington, a BBC business journalist. I'll be hearing about the hype.

0:15.6

They're going to do the deal that makes them the most money at that point of time.

0:19.7

And I'm picking what went wrong, talking to owners and employees to ask, what can we learn?

0:25.4

It was being undercut by similar rivals.

0:28.4

It just couldn't survive.

0:30.3

Toast. Listen first on BBC Sounds.

0:42.7

Hello and welcome to the Witness History podcast from the BBC World Service with me, Rachel Naylor.

0:49.2

I'm taking you back 40 years to the signing of the Schengen Agreement, which abolished border checks in parts of Europe.

0:54.0

The Schengen area now covers a population of more than 450 million people.

0:59.5

The Schengen Agreement is rather a typical European Union construct in that it's a very dull name for something pretty amazing and exciting.

1:03.0

It means that in a continent once wrapped by wars over borders, there are largely no borders.

1:13.6

It's the 14th of June, 1985, and we're in Luxembourg.

1:19.2

Five European politicians are meeting up to sign an ambitious agreement

1:22.9

that's going to get rid of borders between five countries,

1:26.1

Belgium, the Netherlands, Luxembourg, West Germany and France.

1:29.8

But they're not meeting in a capital city, or even in a boardroom.

1:34.5

That's because Robert Goebbels, Luxembourg's Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs,

1:38.7

has other ideas.

1:40.3

I invited to this little village, Schengen, at a point where the borders of France, Germany, Luxembourg and so the Benelux meet.

1:51.6

So it was rather symbolic.

...

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