We knew the story of the international rules-based order was partially false.

That the strongest would exempt themselves when convenient, that trade rules were enforced asymmetrically.

And we knew that international law applied with varying rigor depending on the identity of the accused or the victim.

This fiction was useful. An American hegemony in particular helped provide public goods,

open sea lanes, a stable financial system, collective security, and support for frameworks for resolving disputes. So we placed the sign in the window.

We participated in the rituals.

And we largely avoided calling out the gaps

between rhetoric and reality.

This bargain no longer works.

Let me be direct.

We are in the midst of a rupture, not a transition.

It's Thursday, January 29th, 2026, and welcome back to Goodfellows, a Hoover Institution broadcast,

examining history, economics, and geopolitics. I'm Bill Whalen. I'm a distinguished policy fellow here at the Hoover Institution. I'll be your moderator today.

Moderating a conversation featuring three of my colleagues we jokingly refer to as the Goodfellows.

And they are, of course, the historian, Sir Newell Ferguson, the economist John Cochran,

and former presidential national security advisors slash geostrategist slash whopless optimist,

Lieutenant General, H.R. McMaster.

Neil John and H.R., by the way, they're all Hoover's senior fellows.

Gentlemen, good to see you. We're going to do two topics today.

Second part of our show, we're going to talk about America being on thin ice,

and by ice, I'm referring to immigration customs and enforcement.

The tragedy has occurred in Minnesota and enforcement. The tragedy is

...