The Republican Party’s Decay Began Long Before Trump

The Ezra Klein Show

New York Times Opinion

Society & Culture, Government, News

4.6 • 11K Ratings

🗓️ 4 June 2024

⏱️ 66 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

After Donald Trump was convicted last week in his hush-money trial, Republican leaders wasted no time in rallying behind him. There was no chance the Republican Party was going to replace Trump as their nominee at this point. Trump has essentially taken over the G.O.P.; his daughter-in-law is even co-chair of the Republican National Committee. How did the Republican Party get so weak that it could fall victim to a hostile takeover? Daniel Schlozman and Sam Rosenfeld are the authors of “The Hollow Parties: The Many Pasts and Disordered Present of American Party Politics,” which traces how both major political parties have been “hollowed out” over the decades, transforming once-powerful gatekeeping institutions into mere vessels for the ideologies of specific candidates. And they argue that this change has been perilous for our democracy. In this conversation, we discuss how the power of the parties has been gradually chipped away; why the Republican Party became less ideological and more geared around conflict; the merits of a stronger party system; and more. Mentioned: “Democrats Have a Better Option Than Biden” by The Ezra Klein Show “Here’s How an Open Democratic Convention Would Work” by The Ezra Klein Show with Elaine Kamarck Book Recommendations: The Two Faces of American Freedom by Aziz Rana Rainbow’s End by Steven P. Erie An American Melodrama by Lewis Chester, Godfrey Hodgson, Bruce Page Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected]. You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of “The Ezra Klein Show” at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs. This episode of “The Ezra Klein Show’‘ was produced by Elias Isquith. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris, with Mary Marge Locker, Kate Sinclair and Rollin Hu. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Aman Sahota and Efim Shapiro. Our senior editor is Claire Gordon. The show’s production team also includes Annie Galvin and Kristin Lin. Original music by Isaac Jones. Audience strategy by Kristina Samulewski and Shannon Busta. The executive producer of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser. Special thanks to Sonia Herrero.

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0	From New York Times opinion, this is the Ezra Klein Show. For all the Donald Trump's politics are soaked in nostalgia, his political career could
0:27.5	only exist right now. That's partly because of the media forums that led to his 2016
0:32.2	campaign. He is a creation of
0:34.9	modern reality television that really flowers in the 90s. He joins with The
0:38.7	Apprentice in 2004. He's a creation of Twitter, which launches in 2006. He joins in 2009.
0:46.0	Donald Trump, celebrity candidate. People know that story.
0:50.0	But at most points in American history, he still couldn't have succeeded.
0:53.6	Even if Trump had all that notoriety, all that money, he never could have become a
0:58.5	major party's nominee for president because the party would have stopped him. That would have been its job.
1:04.3	Until the 1970s there was one way and one way only to win a presidential nomination.
1:10.2	He had to win delegates at the convention and you actually had to win them. They didn't walk into the convention committed to vote for you.
1:17.0	Delegates were members of the party, party regulars, party politicians. They were gatekeepers and over and over and over again in American history
1:26.0	they locked the gates against people like Donald Trump. But by the time Trump ran in
1:30.8	2016 those days were over. There were no gatekeepers at the convention. There was no gate.
1:36.7	If you won the primaries, you won. That change in rules reflected something larger,
1:41.1	a hollowing out of what political parties were, a collapse in the legitimacy
1:45.5	of what they once did.
1:47.6	Americans, we've never liked parties.
1:50.0	George Washington's farewell address was a lengthy warning against her predations.
1:54.3	He said, quote, the alternate domination of one faction over another,
1:59.9	sharpened by the spirit of revenge, natural to party dissension, which in different
2:04.7	ages and countries has perpetrated the most horrid enormities, is itself of frightful
	...

Please login to see the full transcript.

Previous episode | Next episode

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from New York Times Opinion, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of New York Times Opinion and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.