The Problem with Wellness Culture, According to Dr. Zeke Emanuel

On with Kara Swisher

New York Magazine

Society & Culture

4.2 • 3.2K Ratings

🗓️ 19 January 2026

⏱️ 59 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Dr. Zeke Emanuel is one of the country’s foremost healthcare experts. An oncologist and the former chair of the Department of Bioethics at the National Institutes of Health, he was one of the architects of the Affordable Care Act and now teaches at the University of Pennsylvania. Emanuel’s new book, “Eat Your Ice Cream: Six Simple Rules for a Long and Healthy Life,” offers practical advice on eating and living well at a time when Americans are bombarded with dubious “wellness” content everywhere they look. Kara and Zeke talk about how nutrition advice has gotten overly complicated; why it’s OK to indulge in the occasional serving of ice cream or glass of wine; and why he mostly dismisses wearable technology as a means of measuring a healthy lifestyle. Emanuel also shares his thoughts on the Trump administration’s latest updates to the food pyramid, and his fears over the distrust the government is sowing around vaccines. Special thanks to Politics and Prose Bookstore for hosting this live conversation. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0	This is my favorite Emanuel, just so you know, I know all the fucking Emanuals.
0:04.6	And they're...
0:05.2	I tell my brother's that all the time.
0:07.0	Yes, exactly.
0:25.1	Hi, everyone from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. This is on with Kara Swisher, and I'm Kara Swisher.
0:31.5	On today's show, I'm speaking with Dr. Zeke Emanuel. He was one of the architects of the Affordable Care Act.
0:36.8	He now teaches health care management, medical ethics, and health policy at the University of Pennsylvania.
0:38.9	He's also an oncologist.
0:44.6	Emmanuel has a new book out this month. It's called Eat Your Ice Cream, Six Simple Rules for a Long and Healthy Life. He offers some practical advice on eating and living well at a time when all of us
0:49.7	are bombarded with dubious wellness content everywhere we look. The Trump administration isn't helping
0:55.3	matters right now either. Spoiler alert, Emmanuel doesn't think eating more beef tallow is the solution
1:01.0	to a healthier life, and he is 100% right. Do not get your nutrition advice from RFK Jr.
1:08.3	All right, let's get into my conversation with Dr. Ezek Emmanuel. This interview
1:12.1	was recorded in front of a live audience at Politics and Prose bookstore in Washington, D.C. Don't go
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	...

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