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I'm your host, Connor Eccles.

Each week, I break down the latest developments in U.S. foreign policy and other global news,

and I interview a leading expert or activist.

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Hey, Van, how you doing?

How are you? Thanks for having me.

Yeah, happy to have you on. Why don't I go ahead and start by introducing us.

So I am Connor Eccles, the managing editor of Non Zero and the host of the weekend edition of the Non Zero podcast, which we are currently on, Non Zero World.

You are Van Jackson, a senior lecturer at the Victoria University of Wellington in New Zealand, and a senior non-resident fellow at the Center for International Policy. You have a ton of affiliations, but another one that I might highlight is that you are the author of the always excellent substack newsletter undiplomatic, as we can see

behind you in many little places. I like the background, as well as the undiplomatic podcast,

of course. So did I get everything I covered the, I cover the house? That's great. The newsletter

was the most important, I guess. Exactly. That's the cross-promotional

opportunities are one of the, are one of the things that we really pride ourselves about here at

Non Zero. So I'm glad we could be of service. But anyway, so I've had you on today, obviously,

to discuss your new book that you co-authored alongside Michael Brennis, which is titled

The Rivalry Paral, How Great Power Competition Threatens Peace and Weakens Democracy.

That's going to be the main topic of the conversation, though I think I might try to ask you

a little bit about sort of your path in your path, uh, in your career as well,

because I'm curious to hear sort of about your shifts that you experienced from being, uh,

sort of almost a member of the foreign policy blob in a sense, right, to, uh, to, uh, to,

...