The music that saves us
All In The Mind
ABC
4.4 • 785 Ratings
🗓️ 29 November 2025
⏱️ 30 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
When bad things happen, do you berate yourself or treat yourself with compassion? Do you journal, meditate, or listen to music?
Growing up, Sabrina McKenzie always turned to music to help her through her worst moments.
As she got older and began studying psychology, she realised what she felt when she listened to sad or angry songs ... was self-compassion.
In the field of positive psychology there’s plenty of research on how journalling and meditation can cultivate self-compassion (and plenty of research suggesting self-compassionate people are more mentally and physically healthy).
But Sabrina was shocked to learn there was no research on whether music could cultivate self-compassion. She decided to change that.
Today: the songs that saved Sabrina, and the novel research looking for a link between music and self-compassion.
This episode touches on the topic of sexual abuse, please take care while listening.
Guest:
Sabrina McKenzieAssociate Lecturer in musicPhD candidate in music psychologyUniversity of Melbourne, Melbourne Conservatorium of Music
Credits:
- Presenter/producer: Sana Qadar
- Senior producer: James Bullen
- Producer: Rose Kerr
- Sound engineer: Roi Huberman
You can catch up on more episodes of the All in the Mind podcast with journalist and presenter Sana Qadar, exploring the psychology of topics like stress, memory, communication and relationships on the ABC Listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts.
Music to listen to:
This Is Me (Official Audio) — The Greatest Showman Cast
More information:
Self-compassion as a predictor of interleukin-6 response to acute psychosocial stress
Exploring the role of music listening in cultivating self-compassion
Support:
Lifeline 13 11 14
Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | ABC Listen, Podcasts, Radio, News, Music and More. |
| 0:07.4 | It is a truth universally acknowledged that on one's 250th birthday, there should be a celebration. |
| 0:15.2 | I'm Claire Nichols, and on the book show, we're raising our teacups to Jane Austen. |
| 0:19.3 | Why, Austin? What is it about it? |
| 0:21.3 | Authors Column Tobin, Karen Joy Fowler and more will explore why in 2025 the Austin |
| 0:27.6 | effect is bigger than ever. That's quite incredible. Search for the book show and look for dear |
| 0:32.9 | Jane wherever you get your podcasts or hear it now on the ABC Listen app. |
| 0:38.0 | A quick heads up before we start. |
| 0:39.9 | This episode touches on the topic of sexual abuse. |
| 0:48.6 | When Sabrina McKenzie thinks back to her early childhood, |
| 0:52.6 | the soundtrack she hears is a bit like this. |
| 0:56.0 | Just reggae, lots of that good soul kind of music. |
| 1:00.0 | Bob Marley, UB40. |
| 1:03.0 | My brother and I used to do so many duets. |
| 1:07.0 | Oh, so many duets. We both sing, and we're both musicians as we grew older as well. |
| 1:11.7 | She grew up in Melbourne, one of five kids, and her very earliest musical memory. |
| 1:17.5 | Singing Greatest Love of All by Whitney Houston in very many family concerts many times. |
| 1:24.1 | We'd find a stage anywhere we were. If we're at home, there was like, you know, a table, we'll build a stage and would sing a song. |
| 1:31.2 | Always a lot of playing, creating and singing. |
| 1:34.2 | Now, it all sounds like the elements of a lovely, loving childhood, but that's not exactly how things played out. |
| 1:42.3 | I've kind of blocked out some of the music that I listened, that my parents pretty much |
| 1:47.9 | listened to back in the day, only because it triggers me. |
... |
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