The Morality of Self-Determination
Moral Maze
BBC
4.5 • 609 Ratings
🗓️ 2 November 2017
⏱️ 43 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
Before the Cava corks had finished popping to celebrate Catalonia's declaration of independence, direct rule was imposed from Madrid, the region's autonomy stripped away; its president sacked. It was a tumultuous few minutes by any country's standards. To some, the Catalan leader Carles Puigdemont is a traitor to Spain who should face criminal charges. To others, he is a Catalan patriot fighting for the region's right to self-determination - a cardinal principle of international law enshrined in the UN charter. When such a right collides with the territorial integrity of a state, competing ideas of democracy emerge. Separatists decry scenes of women being pulled out of polling stations by their hair and the detention of what they call political prisoners. Those sympathetic to the Madrid government are convinced it is they who have the moral high ground and that the actions of Catalan leaders amount to a serious breach of the Spanish constitution. A key moral question centres on what is meant by the "will of the people". In the case of Catalonia, should we base our moral judgements on the 90% who voted for independence in the illegal referendum (which only had a 43% turnout) or on the majority of Catalans who, for whatever reason, didn't vote? Does a democratically-mandated central government have a moral duty to uphold the rule of law for the sake of unity, or can self-determination trump the duty of loyalty to the nation? What are the moral boundaries of self-determination? When, if ever, is a unilateral declaration of independence morally justified? Witnesses are Chris Bambery, Joan Costa Font, Jose V.Rodriguez Mora and Diego Zuluaga.
Producer: Dan Tierney.
Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | You're listening to a programme from BBC Radio 4. |
| 0:03.6 | Good evening. Catalonia's existence as an independent European Republic was brief and pathetic, |
| 0:09.1 | snuffed out in a matter of hours by the Spanish government. Its parliament has been suspended, |
| 0:13.7 | its autonomy replaced by direct rule, its separatist leaders have either fled or faced |
| 0:17.9 | charges of rebellion and sedition that carry 30-year maximum prison sentences. |
| 0:22.4 | It's over, for the moment anyway. |
| 0:24.6 | But many questions remain. |
| 0:26.5 | Are those leaders Catalan patriots or Spanish traitors? |
| 0:30.0 | What uses democracy in defining the public will when, for whatever reason, most people don't vote? |
| 0:35.7 | And the overarching moral issue, how do you balance the principle |
| 0:38.8 | of self-determination against the territorial integrity of the nation-state? There's no doubt it could |
| 0:44.2 | be independent. Its population is far larger than Norway, Denmark or Ireland, its economy |
| 0:49.3 | bigger than Finland, Portugal or Greece. It has its own language and distinct culture. |
| 0:54.6 | So why independent Luxembourg, less than a tenth a size, but not Catalonia, Kurdistan, Cornwall? |
| 1:02.2 | Where do you stop? |
| 1:03.3 | What are the moral limits of self-determination? |
| 1:05.8 | That's our moral maze tonight. |
| 1:06.9 | Our panel, Anne McHelvoy, senior editor at The Economist, |
| 1:09.7 | the former Conservative Cabinet Minister Michael Portillo, Mona Siddiqui, Professor of Islamic and Inter-Religious |
| 1:14.6 | Studies at the University of Edinburgh, and the priest and polemicist, Giles Fraser. Michael |
| 1:20.0 | Portillo, you have a dog in this fight with your Spanish heritage. Do the Catalans have a case, |
| 1:26.7 | a moral argument for independence? |
... |
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