The Merging of Science and Spirituality | Donald Hoffman & Rupert Spira
A New Way of Being
Simon Mundie
4.8 • 523 Ratings
🗓️ 5 May 2025
⏱️ 152 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
In this episode, I sit down with Rupert Spira and Don Hoffman — two people at the leading edge of exploring consciousness and reality — to unpack some of the biggest questions we can ask.
We talk about why space-time might not be fundamental, whether matter is even “real,” and how consciousness could be the ground of everything.
This conversation explores where science, philosophy and spirituality meet — and asks whether modern physics is finally catching up with what the great contemplative traditions have pointed to all along.
Highlights include:
Why space and time might be illusions
The limits of trying to explain consciousness through the brain
What maths might reveal about the nature of reality
Whether our senses are showing us the world as it really is — or not at all
Guests:
Rupert Spira – Philosopher and spiritual teacher
Don Hoffman – Cognitive scientist and author of The Case Against Reality
This one goes deep — but it’s well worth the ride.
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | The Nobel Prize was to three physicists who have experimental confirmation of the prediction of physics |
| 0:05.7 | that what's called local realism is false, that physical objects don't have real values of their |
| 0:13.0 | properties like position momentum when they're not observed. So this is not a small thing. Science needs |
| 0:19.1 | a new foundation. Space time can't be it. We're doomed to fail at solving the hard problem of consciousness if we assume that space and time are fundamental. We cannot solve the problem that way because those assumptions our best science tells us are false. |
| 0:36.1 | Hello and welcome to a new way of being with me, Simon Mundy. |
| 0:40.1 | In this episode, I am joined by two brilliant minds, Rupert Spira and cognitive scientist |
| 0:46.0 | Donald Hoffman, for a deep, but I would hope, accessible dive into the nature of reality. |
| 0:52.7 | We explore some really big questions. What is reality, really? |
| 0:57.7 | Is space and time actually fundamental? And is science finally catching up with what the great |
| 1:03.9 | spiritual traditions have been saying for eons? We also touch on maths, consciousness and why |
| 1:10.2 | your everyday experience might not be what it seems. |
| 1:14.6 | This is a bit of a mindbender, but an enjoyable and important one. Whether you're scientific, spiritual or just curious, there's loads in here to chew on. |
| 1:33.6 | Gentlemen, lovely to be with you. |
| 1:34.6 | Rupert, how are you? |
| 1:36.6 | Very well, Simon. |
| 1:40.0 | Lovely to be with you and lovely to see you again, Don, as well. |
| 1:41.5 | Donald, how are you? |
| 1:42.5 | Great. |
| 1:44.6 | Good to be here and thanks for inviting me. |
| 1:47.4 | Well, and it's a privilege to be here with you both. |
| 1:52.3 | And I've just been finding out you do know each other to some degree already. |
| 1:55.6 | You've spent a bit of time together at the Sand Conference, for example. |
... |
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