Hello, everybody. This is Robbie Gupta, and this is a special episode of The Lost Debate Show.

And what I want to do here is I just want to give you a couple key takeaways from this affirmative action decision that was rendered yesterday.

And we have done a lot of work at both on the Lost Debate Show, but in the branch generally about affirmative action and the

history of the jurisprudence and the policy around affirmative action.

And we'll link in the show notes to a series of articles that we've written and podcast episodes

that we've put out, including a two-part narrative series in the fall, all about this question.

And back in the fall, when I was working on that narrative series on affirmative action,

I talked to a guy named Ted Shaw, who is somebody who has been on the front lines of

affirmative action debates for decades.

He's currently at the University of North Carolina

law school. University of North Carolina was a defendant in this case. Shaw was at the University

of Michigan when the University of Michigan was wrapped up in, you know, two different Supreme

Court cases, one about the undergraduate institution and one with the law school, with the undergraduate

affirmative action program was struck down, but the law school's practices were upheld, and Shaw actually advised the law school, but the undergraduate affirmative action program was struck down,

but the law school's practices were upheld, and Shaw actually advised the law school on those

practices to help them withstand the scrutiny of the court.

He was at the NAACP Legal Defense Fund, and notably for the purposes of today, in the summer

of 1978, he was a third-year law student, happened to be in the courtroom

when the landmark Bakke decision was announced. And this was the beginning of modern

affirmative action jurisprudence was the Bakke decision. And what Shaw told me was he said,

quote, I heard those decisions announced and I left the Supreme Court that day devastated. And quote, you may wonder, like, why was he said, quote, I heard those decisions announced, and I left the Supreme Court that

day devastated. And quote, you may wonder, like, why was he devastated? Because the Baki

...