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Outrage + Optimism: The Climate Podcast

The China Pivot: What will Beijing’s climate leadership look like?

Outrage + Optimism: The Climate Podcast

Persephonica

News, Planet, Business, Society & Culture, Current Affairs, Green, Policy, Finance, Society, Environment, Science, Energy, Climate

4.71.1K Ratings

🗓️ 29 January 2026

⏱️ 35 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

World leaders are flocking to Beijing. In the first weeks of 2026, Canada’s Mark Carney, the UK’s Sir Keir Starmer and South Korea’s Lee Jae-myung have all made high-profile visits - an unmistakable signal of global power recalibrating.


China’s dominance in clean energy manufacturing is already well established: from solar panels and batteries to wind turbines. The question now is whether this transition remains merely made in China, or whether it is increasingly being shaped and led from Beijing.


Christiana Figueres, Tom Rivett-Carnac and Paul Dickinson consider what this shift may mean for the future of climate leadership - and for the institutions, alliances and norms that have shaped global climate cooperation for decades. They’re joined by scholar of China’s political economy and climate governance Yixian Sun, who has recently advised the UK government on their engagement with China. He unpacks the country’s own vision of leadership, its evolving role in the Global South, and the risks and opportunities of an increasingly multipolar climate order.


As the world recalibrates around China’s growing role, how does Beijing see itself? And what are other governments actually seeking as they turn towards it? We spoke to the man advising the UK government ahead of Keir Starmer’s arrival in Beijing. 


 

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Producer: Ben Weaver-Hincks

Planning: Caitlin Hanrahan

Assistant Producer: Caillin McDaid

Exec Producer: Ellie Clifford


This is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network.



Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Transcript

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0:00.0

Hello and welcome to outrage and optimism. I'm Tom Rivikarnik.

0:05.0

I'm Christiana Fierrez.

0:06.0

And I'm Paul Dickinson.

0:07.0

Today we talk about how climate leadership is creating a new role for China in global geopolitics.

0:13.0

Thanks for being here.

0:15.0

So it's only a couple of months since we did a deep dive into China while we were in Bel-Am.

0:20.0

But actually, over the last few months, the world has changed in all kinds of interesting ways.

0:25.1

As Donald Trump's rhetoric and narrative has become increasingly isolationist and aggressive towards former allies,

0:32.0

we have seen subtle but determined shifts towards getting closer to China, whether it's Mark Carney's visit or the

0:38.5

approval of the embassy in London or a future visit by Kirstama. There is a lot of interest and

0:43.4

excitement. And you could even say sense of necessity from many other Western countries in getting

0:49.1

closer to China. Now, there is also a narrative that is creating a counterpoint to that.

0:54.3

We have seen many right of centre politicians like Howard Lutnik and Donald Trump and Nigel Farage and Jordan Bardela say deploying clean energy domestically is making their countries more subservient to China because of the dominance that China now has in the manufacturing of clean energy

1:13.5

infrastructure.

1:14.5

The hidden agenda.

1:16.0

The hidden agenda.

1:17.0

Is it a hidden agenda?

1:18.5

Why do you say the hidden agenda?

1:20.4

I don't, just to be clear, I don't call it a hidden agenda.

1:23.9

I'm just reflecting.

1:25.0

Are you hiding that you don't call it hidden agenda?

1:26.3

I'm hiding that I don't know.

...

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