This is Gavin Newsom.

And this is Eric Holder.

This is an I-Heart podcast, guaranteed human.

He and I sat down and talked about, let's kind of look back and see what is it that we didn't accomplish and what were the reasons why we were not as successful as

we might have been. And we looked at a variety of things and, you know, it really kind of, we kind of

tried to feel, well, why, why, why? And we really came to the conclusion that gerrymandering was a

problem that prevented him from getting in full his agenda, though he had significant accomplishments.

And as we looked more, he said, you know, and a lot of the stuff that's coming out of the state is unpopular and nevertheless gets passed.

And that was also as a result of gerrymandering in state legislatures.

And so he said, all right, let's go after that problem.

And so we formed up the

National Democratic Redistricting Committee in January of 2017 to really promote fairness in the

redistricting process. Republicans had put together through a thing called Project Redmap in 2011,

gerrymanders in a whole variety of states that have endured, endured through the course

of that whole decade, and put in place measures at the state level that, you know, people

didn't like, but nevertheless, Republicans did it and didn't suffer any political consequence

because of the gerrymanders. And then we had a gerrymandered House of Representatives.

And if you look, when we started out, Democrats had to overperform by about 22% in order to get to

50-50 in the House of Representatives as a result of what we've done. That number is now just about

one and a half percent, something like that. We can actually, you know, actually handle that.

And so we've promoted fairness, and that is,

fairness has almost been like a weapon for us.

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