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Hello and welcome to the Spectator's Book Club podcast. I'm Sam Leith, the literary

editor of The Spectator. This week I'm very pleased to be joined by Colin McCann,

who already a very distinguished novelist has written something slightly out of his usual line in his new book, American Mother, which is written or co-written with Diane Foley, who is the mother of James Foley, the American journalist who was murdered by ISIS in Syria in 2014.

Welcome, Colin.

Thank you.

I mean, the first question to ask is just, how did this book come about?

I mean, you've got a very blottering career in literary fiction and in some ways you know a sort of book

written with you know a sort of well-known person writing about this sort of thing kind of slots

into a kind of non-fiction genre that wouldn't obviously be a match for someone yeah it's my

first take on on in, in nonfiction.

But it actually, it laces in with a lot of the other books.

So it's written with Diane Foley, as you said, you know, the mother of James Foley.

And probably the second most iconic photograph of the first part of the 21st century after the tower is coming down was Jim Foley

in the desert in the orange jumpsuit with the you know the man the black balaclav beside him

and we all know what happened Jim Jim was beheaded so I remember the day when that came into

my inbox and you know it was just, it was one of those stunning images.

A lot of us actually remember where we were when, when, when that image came in.

Later that same day, however, some other friends of mine sent me images of Jim Foley.

...