To hear the full episode, become a patron at petriam.com slash netpanel pod.

So I guess that's that's a long way around of saying there's a kind of conventional story

about intellectual property, which is that it's essential if markets are going to produce

information because otherwise we're not going to get enough money put into the producing

of things like drugs

and the vaccine.

One obvious answer to that is, well, let's not rely so much on markets because it has all the

downsides.

And it turns out when you scratch the surface, you see that we don't actually rely so much

on markets.

In fact, people may or may not be familiar with how much public money went into the COVID

vaccines, for example. And how much, in fact, public management money went into the COVID vaccines, for example,

and how much, in fact, public management even went into the COVID vaccines,

is kind of helping the companies figure out how to design tests that showed what we wanted to,

you know, to learn and so forth, and sort of pushing them through the regulatory process.

So the public is enormously involved, particularly for the most important diseases and interventions. And we see lots of problems

with the sort of market-led way of developing these things. A big part of that, you know,

what I've spent a long time thinking and studying is about the sort of mismatch

between market demand, quote unquote, and public health needs. So around the world, you know,

you don't see big demand for Ebola vaccine, other kinds of interventions until, and there's like

literally one of my favorite things I used to teach with was an onion headline that said, you know, Ebola vaccine 14 white people away, you know. And it really was true, actually. It was I almost got the number right. Like how many people in the North had to die of Ebola before we got investment in an Ebola vaccine. So, so there's some real

downsides of the existing model with a lot of public research and then private kind of property

...