This is exactly right.

I'm Kate Winkler-Dawson. I'm a journalist who's spent the last 25 years writing about true crime.

And I'm Paul Holes, a retired cold case investigator whose work some of America's most complicated cases

and solve them.

Each week, I present Paul with one of history's most compelling true crimes.

And I weigh in using modern forensic techniques to bring new insights to old mysteries.

Together, using our individual expertise, we're examining historical true crime cases through a 21st century lens.

Some are solved and some are cold, very cold. This is buried bones. Hey, Paul.

Hey, Kate. How are you?

I'm doing well. I know I left you hanging with Thelma Todd, the very talented Thelma Todd, the Hollywood actress.

Do you want to give us a little bit of a recap since I know it's been a week for some of our viewers and our listeners?

Yeah, you know, from what I remember and what stood out to me in the first episode on this case,

Thelma Todd was a young actress, actually very accomplished actress, lived in an apartment above

a restaurant that she owned with a lover who happened to also be married to another woman. So there's a little bit of a lover's

triangle within Thelma's life. And this lover Roland, who was a, he was a director or an executive,

right? He was a director, film director. Film director. It has this beautiful house up a very

steep hill in the Pacific Palisades. Thelma goes out on a

Saturday night, and I don't think we discussed the details of, you know, what she did that night.

However, her housekeeper May ended up Monday morning looking for Thelma and found Thelma slumped in the driver's side of

her car in the garage of Roland's house. Autopsy indicated she had a fractured nose, she

had some bleeding out of the mouth, and she had carbon monoxide poisoning. And that's

where we left off. You got it. We've got now a whole host of, I think, very confusing information.

...