Ted Audio Collective.

I didn't share all that much work I don't think when you were growing up.

I would leave the house around 5 in the morning

and see Nick at night,

the network, not the boy.

From the TED audio collective this is Design Matters with Debbie Milman.

For 18 years Debbie Millman.

For 18 years, Debbie Millman has been talking with designers and other creative people about

what they do, how they got to be who they are, and what they're thinking about and working

on. On this episode

father and son Stephen and Nick Heller talk about their careers and about the

weirdness and wonders of New York City. A lot of people, like whenever I'm walking with

somebody and something outlandish happens, they're like, why does this always

happen when I'm with you?

Hey listener, a quick favor. We are conducting an audience survey and we'd be really grateful if you could take just a few minutes to respond.

Please visit survey. PRX.org slash design matters to take the survey today. That's surveyR.X.org.

P.R.X.org. design matters. Thanks.

This conversation took place in front of a live audience on October 13th at the

2023 AIGA design conference in New York City. A native New Yorker, Stephen Heller, is also one of the most influential art directors, design thinkers, and cultural critics in the entire world.

He started his illustrious career working for many 60s era counterculture periodicals

before joining the New York Times as an art director of the

op-ed page and the book review where he worked for over three decades.

...