Welcome to the global phenomenon, Surviving the Survivor, where we bring you the best guests in all of true crime.

Here's your host, Emmy Award-winning journalist Joel Waldman.

Are you pleading guilty because you are guilty?

That was a question that Judge Stephen Hippler asked at this historic plea hearing today, and the response from

Brian Coburger was cold, it was chilling, and it was simple. The response was yes. He showed no

remorse. He admitted Brian Coburg, Coburger did, to the murders of Kaylee Gonzalves, Madison Mogan, Xanacrenodal, and Ethan Chapin,

and that he did it all with premeditation.

This is Surviving and Survivor, the show that brings you the very best guests in all of true crime.

And every once in a while they're so good that they are actual literal living

legends. Let me introduce Anne and bring her in. And I'm going to explain what happened to Catherine

Ramsland. How you doing, Ann? I'm doing good, Joel. Good, good. So Dr. Ann Burgess, for those

who have been living under Iraq, he's an internationally recognized pioneer in the assessment and treatment of victims of

trauma and abuse.

She's also the author of The Killer by Design.

And among her many awards and accolades, as I mentioned in 2016, she was named a living

legend by the American Academy of Nursing.

She still teaches at Boston College and she still writes and she still goes to Scott Duffy's seminars in Wilmington and asked me if I was going to be a crime con.

Anne has more energy than like 17, 20 year olds combined.

She has a new book, too, called Expert Witness,

The Weight of Our Testimony, When Justice Hangs in the Balance.

It is called Expert Witness, The Weight of Our Testimony, When Justice Hangs in the Balance.

It is by Ann Burgess and Steve Constantine.

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