I think that the holidays feel like frozen noses. I love walking with the dog for long periods of time.

Hopefully it's snowing and you've got to wrap up warm. So I think a frozen nose is a sweaty armpit

because your wrapped up so warm but then you're climbing hamps and heath and you get to the top

and you're like, and then you can see the breath but then your nose is still freezing to touch.

Joy in every sip with red cups now back at Starbucks. So I am just delighted to have this man on as a guest.

There's obviously no such thing as the best political writer alive.

But if anybody asked me to name the four or five best political writers alive,

the first words out of my mouth would be Shelby Steele. He is the Robert J. Ann Marion,

E. Oster Fellow at the Hoover Institute. He has won the Bradley Prize for his contributions

to the study of race in America. His books, if you've never read one of his books,

they're short and they are absolutely beautiful. Shelby Steele, thank you so much for coming on.

Well, thank you so much for that introduction and thanks for having me.

So I've been watching what's going on in our country and it seems to me,

I've been kind of describing it as a moment of moral panic and it seems to be a moral panic.

The center is among other things on race and it reminds me of things I've read about the McCarthy era,

the witch hunts. I'm wondering if you think there is truth in that description

and if you think there's truth in that description, why is it happening now?

Easy, easy question. No, I think it, I think that if you look at the span of American history,

in the 60s, that racial tension that it always been really at the heart of American life and culture.

It came to a head and it transformed and introduced,

along with the principles of democracy, the Constitution, the Bill of Rights,

it introduced morality as a source of entitlement, power, rights.

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