Shabana Mahmood: Racism, Asylum and Me
Political Thinking with Nick Robinson
BBC
4.6 • 2.5K Ratings
🗓️ 20 November 2025
⏱️ 50 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
Why is the Home Secretary warning against leaving space for "darker forces"?
Shabana Mahmood sits down with Nick off the back of announcing sweeping changes to the asylum system in the UK.
Why did she decide to quote explicit racial abuse in the House of Commons? And how does she intend to avoid "ceding the territory of asylum to the far right"?
The Home Secretary reflects on how her Muslim faith plays a part in her job and sense of public service. And she reflects on the "humiliation" of the Downing Street briefing chaos.
Producer: Daniel Kraemer Research: Chloe Desave Sound: Ged Sudlow and Hal Haines Editor: Jonathan Brunert
Transcript
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| 0:26.0 | Hello and welcome to political thinking. |
| 0:28.7 | If we fail to deal with this crisis, we'll draw more people down a path that starts with anger |
| 0:34.9 | and ends in hatred. |
| 0:37.3 | So said my guest on political thinking this week, Home Secretary Shabana Mahmood, |
| 0:41.7 | as she unveiled a package of reforms designed to combat what she calls illegal migration, |
| 0:47.9 | which she says is tearing our country apart. |
| 0:51.5 | Mahmoud, the daughter of Pakistani immigrants and a devout Muslim, says changes needed in part |
| 0:57.6 | because a country without secure borders is a less safe country for those who look like me. |
| 1:05.3 | Shabana Mahmoud, Home Secretary, welcome back to political thinking. Thank you. There's some phrases I really |
| 1:10.5 | want to unpack there |
| 1:11.5 | because I want to start by trying to understand this journey you've been on |
| 1:15.4 | towards a tougher approach on migration. |
| 1:19.7 | But I want to start with words you used in the House of Commons. |
| 1:24.4 | Words that you were asked to apologise for by the deputy speaker, words I am not |
| 1:29.1 | permitted to repeat on air under BBC guidelines, but I'm sure you did it deliberately. You |
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