Sarah and Nippy were both looking for more focus in their lives.

More mental self-discipline, more success.

Many of us have been there.

They wanted to confront the psychological baggage they were carrying around that might be holding them back.

Sure, of course, makes sense. Sounds healthy.

So they found some classes that seemed to help other people, tried them.

The classes seemed promising. They kept at it.

And after a while, without fully realizing it, they were deeply embedded in an

organization, one that promised growth and healing, but that attacked their sense of self and their

place in society. A group that made obedience to the group and subservience to its charismatic

leader the most important things in the

world, a group that turned out to be involved in crimes like sex trafficking, forced labor, wire

fraud, racketeering. Sarah and Nippy were in a cult called Nexium for a long time. It messed them up in ways they're still working

through. But they got out and they're talking about it, including here. It's depression mode.

I'm John Moe. I'm glad you're here. You're free to come and go as you please. I have no doomsday

scenario. I have no compound for you to go live on. I do like to think I have a modicum

of charisma, and later on I will ask you for money, but it's just a podcast. This is not a cult,

I promise. I've always been fascinated by the mental health aspect of cult membership.

How is someone doing psychologically before they joined up? What happened to their

mind during their time with the cult? And how was their mental health after being in a group like that?

I think it's comforting to think, well, I could never be sucked into something like that. I'm too

smart. I'm too aware. But I think a lot of us feel

...