Samantha Ellis on food, family and finding your identity in your 40s

The Shift with Sam Baker

Sam Baker Ltd

Society & Culture, Health & Fitness, Personal Journals

4.8 • 525 Ratings

🗓️ 25 November 2025

⏱️ 59 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

My guest today is a woman on a mission to preserve the language of her grandparents. Playwright, screenwriter and novelist Samantha Ellis is the author of one of my personal favourites How To Be A Heroine. Sam was in her early 40s and a new mum when it dawned on her that her mother tongue - or milk language - was on the verge of dying out. The daughter of Iraqi-Jewish refugees, Sam grew up surrounded by the noisy vivid hot sounds of Judeo-Iraqi Arabic, but when she tried to tell her son he was chopping onions on her heart, she realised she couldn’t find the words - and even if she could, he wouldn’t understand them. In her evocatively titled book of the same name, Sam goes back through the lives of her parents and grandparents, from Iraq to Israel to London and in so doing discovers far more about herself than she could ever have imagined. Sam takes us on a journey back to 1950s Baghdad to share what she discovered about herself and her family heritage and how it’s shaped her as she heads towards 50. We also discussed intergenerational trauma, uses for coriander, cooking as a cure for overthinking, learning to belly dance and the unexpected joy of not being allowed to hold your stomach in! * You can buy all the books mentioned in this podcast at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Shift bookshop on Bookshop.org⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, including Chopping Onions on My Heart by Samantha Ellis as well as the book that inspired this podcast, The Shift: how I lost and found myself after 40 - and you can too, by me. * If you enjoyed this episode and you fancy buying me a coffee, pop over to my page on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠buymeacoffee.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. • And if you'd like to support the work that goes into making this podcast and get a weekly newsletter plus loads more content including exclusive transcripts of the podcast, why not join The Shift community, come and have a look around at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠www.theshiftwithsambaker.substack.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0	This is a paid message from GoFundMe.
0:02.9	My name is Ashley Kane.
0:04.6	I'm the daddy of a little girl in heaven and a father to two boys on earth.
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0:50.7	That's gofundme.com.
0:56.7	This message reflects one. That's go fund me.com. G-O-F-U-N-D-M-E.com.
0:59.8	This message reflects one person's experience.
1:11.2	Hello and welcome to The Shift, the podcast that aims to tell the no-holds bar truth about being a woman post-40,
1:15.6	created and hosted by me, writer and broadcaster, Sam Baker.
1:21.2	My guest today is a woman on a mission to preserve the language of her grandparents.
1:26.8	Playwright, screenwriter and novelist Samantha Ellis is the author of one of my personal favorites, How to Be a Heroin.
1:29.7	Sam was in her early 40s and a new mum, when it dawned on her that her mother tongue,
1:35.1	or milk language, as it sometimes called, was on the verge of dying out.
1:40.2	The daughter of Iraqi Jewish refugees, Sam grew up surrounded by the noisy, vivid, hot sounds
	...

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