This is CBSI in the world. I'm John Batchel with Gregory Zuckerman. His new book is A Shot

to Save the World, the inside story of the life or death race for a COVID-19 vaccine,

taking place over many decades, certainly here over all of the 21st century so far. the methodology of RNA, not proved yet, but it's

the methodology that modern is following. Now we go to a genius, a man who is gifted, enormously

gifted. His name is Dan Baruch. He is so gifted, his colleagues working with him at Beth Israel, Deaconess Medical Center, and elsewhere, come up with an adjective meaning Baruchian.

Your style is Baruchian.

Gregory, what do we need to know about Dan Baruch and how eventually he will come to Johnson and Johnson?

So we talked about MRNA, and there were people like Bancel and Moderna spending years working on that and improving that approach.

But there was another approach at the same time that other scientists around the world were trying to improve and hone.

And it was also controversial.

And that's what Dan Baruch was doing.

It was an approach using a virus, taking a virus and using it as a vaccine, as the basis of vaccine.

And what Dan Baruch did is use something called Ad26.

It's a harmless cold virus.

And you say, well, why would you inject a virus in your body to heal, to teach the body as part of a vaccine?

Well, they render, they may,

they change the composition, the chemical composition of this 26 virus, Baruch was able to make it harmless. So it's a harmless virus. And the idea being you're going to shepherd in a genetic

message. The virus is going to be injected in the body and it's going to

carry a message. And what's that message? It's going to tell the immune system to create a protein.

And he was focused on HIV. And the whole idea was to create a protein and HIV protein in the body.

And you saw it and say yourself, what's the point of that? Well, it's to teach

the immune system to identify that protein. And then if the body ever encounters that protein,

...