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The John Batchelor Show

S8 Ep1124: The Dodo: From Evolutionary Isolation to the Icon of Extinction Guest: Stephen Moss Book Title: Ten Birds That Changed the World The dodo serves as the primary icon of extinction, a concept that was incomprehensible to the 17th-century religious mind. Evo

The John Batchelor Show

John Batchelor

Books, News, Arts, Society & Culture

4.5 β€’ 2.8K Ratings

πŸ—“οΈ 13 July 2026

⏱️ 9 minutes

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Summary

The Dodo: From Evolutionary Isolation to the Icon of Extinction Guest: Stephen Moss Book Title: Ten Birds That Changed the World The dodo serves as the primary icon of extinction, a concept that was incomprehensible to the 17th-century religious mind. Evolving on the predator-free island of Mauritius, the flightless dodo was defenseless when Dutch sailors introduced dogs, rats, and monkeys, leading to its disappearance within 80 years. Moss notes that most museum "dodos" are actually models made of chicken feathers and wire, as contemporaries never thought to preserve a species they believed could never vanish. However, the dodo's tragic fate inspired modern successes, such as Carl Jones'work in the 1970s. By using "double clutching" β€” taking eggs to force a second laying β€” Jones saved the Mauritiuskestrel from a population of just a dozen birds. This legacy continues today through efforts to make islands predator-free to protect vulnerable seabirds, proving that the dodo's extinction eventually taught humanity the value of active conservation. (4)
1869 WOOD PIGEON

Transcript

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0:00.0

Ten birds have changed the world.

0:06.7

Stephen Moss's new book.

0:08.6

He's also a producer, but the author of a book that reveals to me again and again,

0:14.0

language is important, and the word extinction is frightening.

0:18.4

How many extinctions have been since the creation of the earth

0:21.5

in the bombardment of three and a half to four billion years ago?

0:25.1

But this one, the dodo bird, turns out to be the author

0:30.0

of the word extinction that enters into the vocabulary

0:34.2

of the century since he was first discovered.

0:37.7

I believe it was the 16th century when a ship called there.

0:41.5

And the dodo no longer exists, but the word extinction is now important for those who move to save or protect or in some way worry about the habitats and the destruction of our birds.

0:56.2

The humble dodo, I learned from you that when the Dutch first found him,

1:01.5

they call him the wallow birds, and they regarded him as loathsome.

1:05.4

What happened to him?

1:06.4

Why did they go away on the Mauritius Islands suddenly, Stephen?

1:10.1

Well, what I haven't realized about the dodo was that unlike other oceanic islands that were

1:16.4

colonized by humans during the sort of age of empire, if you like, in the 16th, 17th, 18th centuries,

1:22.4

Mauritius was not inhabited by people. So unlike America, unlike New Zealand, unlike Australia, where there were,

1:29.3

humans were there already, Mauritius was the place where the dodo lived and it had involved

1:36.2

not to have to fly because why would it have to fly if there's no enemies and there were also

1:40.1

no predators, no ground predators, no mammals.

1:54.6

And unfortunately, the Dutch sailors, who arrived, I think, in 1597 or 98, brought in dogs and cats and rats and actually macaque monkeys, which they kept as pets.

...

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