My MB Alex breakdown is supported by Helix sleep. Bring is in the air and so are all of the allergens that come with it. Spring allergens means you need more sleep, but there are a ton of factors that can prevent us from getting a good night's rest. Night sweats, back pain, feeling the person next to you when they roll over a million times. We were so excited to hear that Helix wanted to partner with us. I've had my Helix mattress for about five years now and I have been sleeping so much better. Jonathan and also our kids love their Helix mattresses and all of those issues, night sweats, back pain, motion transfer, those things are significantly better with a Helix mattress. Helix delivers your mattress right to your door, which is so much fun with free shipping in the US. They have a 120 night sleep trial and limited lifetime warranty plus they're happy with Helix guarantee. Rest easy with seamless returns and exchanges. The happy with Helix guarantee offers a risk-free customer first experience designed to ensure that you're completely satisfied with your new mattress. Go to helixleap.com slash break down for 27% off site wide. That's helixleap.com slash breakdown

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Hi, I'm Mayan Bialik.

And I'm Jonathan Cohen.

And welcome to our breakdown.

It is mental health month.

And in honor of mental health month,

we're gonna revisit an episode from last year

with Dr. Martha Beck. You may know her as Oprah's life coach. She's a Harvard educated sociologist, New York Times best-selling author, and she is the leading authority on personal growth, resolving childhood trauma, and truly fixing anxiety. She helped us reveal the link between stress and disease. She broke down her cutting edge techniques with foundations in somatic experiencing, sociology and psychology to really get to the root of anxiety. She talks about chronic illness and how to tap into hidden powers you have so that you can live authentically. Martha also explains how trauma is actually hijacking your body and its ability to have intuition, to really know if you're sensing danger or not, and how your muscles literally weaken when you lie. Martha was also one of our early guests as we sort of delved deeper into science and spirituality. She opened up about her near-death experience, how she harnesses feelings of love and happiness, and her fascinating psychic experiences, including remote viewing abilities, the surprising connection between healing trauma and increasing your intuition, and Martha also has a special need son, and she talks about some of the incredible powers she discovered that he has as well as the incredible connection that they have. Just before we get to this episode, did you know that 43% of people who listen to the

podcast are not always subscribed. Go ahead, make sure you're subscribed. It's free. And if you want extra amazing mind-biolic breakdown material, check us out on Substack where we release content that is not available anywhere else. And now in honor of Mental Health Month, we hope you enjoy this episode with Dr. Martha Beck. Break it down. Welcome to the Breakdown. It's really an honor to speak to you. We're so glad that you have the time to talk to us. The honor is all mine. Huge, huge fan. I've been looking over. of so many books, but I in particular pulled out the way of integrity, finding the path

to your true self, finding your own North Star, the science and magic, a finding your destiny, how I lost the Mormons and found my faith. You know, a lot of your work is geared around this kind of journey. And I wonder if in your own words, you could sort of explain kind of the overarching sort of purpose of all of the different kinds of work that you do. It's really simple. I do not like pain. I'm not like other people suffering hurts me. I just, I really hate suffering and I started out my life as many, many people do and dysfunctional circumstances that led to a lot of emotional pain. And I just wanted to figure it out. I was trying to get out of it and it led to me changing all kinds of things in my internal world and then that would trigger change in my relationships and in my behavior in the world and what I pursued. And I was always, because I didn't understand anything about being a human, nothing. I would just write everything down. Okay, this works. When I wrote, finding your own North Star, I thought, this is the stupidest book in the world. No one does not know this because all it says, literally, and they all, this is all they say, all those books. If something really hurts you and you're miserable and you're health is declining when you're doing it, consider doing it a little less. And if something makes you joyful and fills you with energy and makes you love everyone

in the world, maybe do a little more of that. I know it's huge, huge concept. That's it. So yeah, they're all about that. How I went from doing things that may be suffer to doing things all the way to doing things that allow me to be, as I believe we are,

on naturally programmed to be, really, really content and happy almost all the time. It sounds deceptively and seductively simple, but I'm sure you encounter, as you have encountered for your whole career, especially as sort of a public-facing person, people for whom it doesn't seem like they sort of know how to get there. No, nobody does. I'd like you to explain a little bit about maybe you're upbringing and how you got to the point where you didn't know, but also what you've learned from your experience about what I think a lot of people are experiencing, which is this not knowing. Yeah. So they're not knowing. I'm going to start with that, actually. I published that book, which says if it makes you feel good, do more of it. If it makes you feel horrible, do less of it. And people were amazed. And they were like, wait, say that again, no one's ever said that to me. And the reason is that human cultures rely on conformity to retain their solidity. And people get very bought in. We have brains as you know better than I do that are primed for social agreement and gaining social acceptance. So the natural path of an animal is to do what makes it feel healthier and happier. But humans have this socialization tendency, this very strong component of socialization, that makes us want to please the people around us even more than we want to be happy. So you're born a baby and everything's great and you're just

doing baby things. I was born 65 years old. I don't know what you're talking about. Like Benjamin Button. Yeah, everything's going along fine and tell you realize that the people around you like it better when you smile and when you cry, the people around you, if you're a girl baby, they like it when you're demure and soft and when you're a boy, baby. They like it when you're brave and durable or whatever. And when we encounter that mismatch between our true nature, what our genotype tells us to be and our socialization, we sell out ourselves hard and we do it before we even learn

to talk. And once we do learn to talk, we're full of instructions about what we should be and do. And because we want so desperately and need so desperately to belong, the true self just gets shoved aside and the social rules. Whatever they are for us particularly come to dominate. So I was raised in the heart of Mormonism, in like what are the Mormon-esque Mormon places in a very Mormon-y family, super duper Mormon. And some 25 years later, I would learn that the three great enemies of Mormonism, according to the leaders, in these latter days, that means now, three great enemies, feminists, intellectuals, and homosexuals. And I am all three. Oops. So for me being true to myself, man, that ultimately I had to go against a very strong cultural, a set of cultural rules and like lost a tremendous number of relationships, family relationships, friendships, pretty much everything that raised me. And that is very, very difficult, but I can tell your listeners now, it is not as difficult as living outside your true self. You have to find your way back to that baby you sold out. Oh, mine be Alex Raychan is supported by optimizers. I struggled to get get good quality sleep and I just thought like, oh, it's stress, but I learned during paramanopause and menopause, your hormones shift and it affects your magnesium levels. Low magnesium makes everything harder, not just sleep, but focus, mood, stress tolerance. That's why we added magnesium breakthrough by by optimizers to our nightly routine. It's a blend of seven different forms of magnesium designed to support relaxation and overall sleep quality. Try it, see if you wake up more rested and refreshed. You've got nothing to lose and a lot to gain. Bioptimizers offers a 365-day no-questions asked money back guarantee. Magnesium breakthrough is a fantastic way to improve that hormonal imbalance that especially happens with magnesium. And then you have better focus, you have better sleep hygiene in general. Bi optimizers makes it so easy. Here's what you get when you go to bioptimizers.com slash breaker and use the code breaker. 15% off your entire order and a free bottle of mass signs. That's bioptimizers best selling digestive enzyme added to your order automatically when you use our exclusive code. That's a $20 product free on top of your discount. This is a limited time offer while supplies last. You cannot get this on Amazon. You can't get it in stores. The offer exists in one place. Our link, our code, that's it. So if you were already thinking about trying it, this is the sign. Go to bioptimizers.com slash breaker, use the code breaker, grab it before it's gone. Make 2026. The year you finally start sleeping again, my and B. Alex break down is supported by bioptimizers. You know, I struggled to get good quality sleep and I just assumed it was stress. But as I learned, during paramanopause and menopause, your hormones shift in a way that affects your magnesium levels. And low magnesium, it makes everything harder, not just sleep, focus, mood, your tolerance for stress. That's why I have added magnesium breakthrough by by optimizers to my nightly routine. It's a blend of seven different forms of magnesium designed to support relaxation and overall sleep quality. Try it. See if you wake up more rest and refreshed. You've got nothing to lose and a lot to gain. Bi optimizers offers a 365 day. No questions asked. Money back guarantee. Magnesium breakthrough is a huge breakthrough to improve hormonal balance, to help with focus, decrease brain fog, improve sleep hygiene overall. Bi optimizers makes it very easy. Jonathan, what do they get when they go to bi optimizers.com slash break or and use the code breaker? You get 15% off your entire order and a free bottle of mass times by optimizers best selling digestive enzyme. That'll be added to your order automatically when you use our exclusive code. That's a $20 product free on top of your discount already. This is a limited time offer and while supplies last,

you can't get it on Amazon, you can't get it in stores. This offer exists in one place. Our link, our code, that's it. So maybe you were already thinking about it. This is the sign. Go to buyoptimizers.com slash breaker. Use the code breaker, grab it before it's gone. Make 2026 the year, you finally start sleeping again. So let's talk a little bit about the true self because when we think of also human development, babies exist on not to use Freudian terminology, but sort of a pleasure principle. They want to be held and they want to be fed. They want to be rested. They don't want to sit in their own feces or urine. What? When you talk about the true self, you know, is the enemy religion, is it culture? You know, how do we kind of get back to a true self if we have to exist, you know, for all intents and purposes as social creatures and sometimes in particular patriarchal structures? Like where's that true self? Yeah, the true self, the culture, whatever it is, tends at some moments in some ways to go against everyone's particular nature. And that's not horrible. When I give speeches, I used to like stop right in the middle of a speech and I'd say, before I go on, are you all comfortable? And everybody would be sitting in these like hotel ballrooms going, yes. And I'd say, no, really tell me, are you truly comfortable? And they'd be like, yes, go on with your speech. And I'd say, all right, then tell me this, how many of you, if you were home alone right now, would be sitting in exactly the position you're in at this moment? Not a hand would go up. And then I would say, why would you not be in this position? And there would follow 10 or 15 seconds of deep silence as they tried to figure out why they would like take their shoes off and lie down when they got home. And then they would start to realize, I am not completely comfortable, which is not a problem. Doing things like it's a culturally accepted thing to get together in a room. Everybody sits up. Everybody is quiet. Everybody looks at the stage. Everybody follows the cultural agreement. Terrific. They're slightly uncomfortable doing it. That's fine. We can handle so much discomfort. The problem comes when they look me in the eyes in clear daylight and say, I am completely comfortable. And at the moment they say it, they totally believe it and they know they're lying. So this creates a fracture between the sort the entire neuroception, the feeling of the entire body and emotional system and all that. And what they know of their own lives, they don't know that what's really happening is that they're mildly uncomfortable, but they've learned to put up with it for the sake of a function we all want to do together. And it's the mismatch between truth, it's the loss of the truth of what we really want, of what truly makes us comfortable. When we lose that, we lose something very precious and irreplaceable and we go into psychological suffering. I think this disconnect between ourselves, what we think is required, and that chasm can be so great that we have just separated from any notion. Like, my ame teases me that like, I know when my feet are hot. And she's like, why would anyone even pay attention to that? Or, you know, the notion of sitting in a ballroom like, I realized years ago, there's no reason why I can't stand up in a business meeting in one of those boardrooms or ballrooms and stand on the side and not sit down. But, and some people think that's crazy. Like, I will get up in a business meeting, I will pace. And I'm like, there's no reason why we've decided that everyone has to sit in these chairs being so restricted. Like it makes me go crazy. And then I just hate being there. So I decided that that should not be a rule that applies to everyone. You are an unusual individual. So oh yes he is. That's just the tip of the iceberg. But I mean, you're both like way ahead of the curve on this because I think you both live very ex I'm guessing with Jonathan, but what I know of you, my name is you live very examined lives. And you're actually using what in a lot of cultures, not just therapy is called a compassionate witness or a watcher, a part of the self that is looking at behavior in emotion and saying, ah, that's interesting. One of that's true. And that tendency to question is extraordinarily useful. In order to heal from suffering, we don't need to like immediately take big strides toward some set of mental health criteria that somebody put in a book. All we have to do is say, okay, no wait, I'm doing this and my feet are hot and wearing shoes. Why? And that right there breaks the cultural trance. I bet people were shocked when you did that. Not worth anything. It took some getting used to. What did they do? I mean, thankfully I started to be able to do this in environments where I was amongst others who, you know, it wasn't a very conformist environment and independence was celebrated. But like, you know, there became times where I'm like, I don't think this meeting applies to me and I would leave. Now, I love that so much. And when someone said, hey, where what, you know, I'm like, I think this doesn't impact me or I don't really have anything to contribute here. I'm going to talk to you later and let me know if there's things that I can contribute later on. And they required some conversation, but yeah, lots of people think they get upset by it, but I don't know that they get upset because it's actually wrong or they haven't given themselves permission to do the same so that they're struggling by these notions of conformity and they're upset at anyone else who chooses to act differently. I think the second definition, and I think people, the more they have repressed some natural thing in themselves, and they're holding themselves in this position of suffering because they're telling themselves it's the right thing to do, those are the people who most aggressively attack others who break the mold. And it's so interesting because you can watch people like that get more and more and more rigid until they can't bear it anymore. And then some of those people will just kind of completely explode and just go completely outside of culture. I've had clients who, when they started breaking the rules, got so excited about it that they started sort of running a muck and ended up in some really awkward situations having to deal with a lot of drama. But the way you're doing it, I'm thinking about this, I'm not comfortable. Is there any reason? Not at this moment. This is not about me. Okay, I'm going to get up and go, oh, everybody's upset. That's all right. What I'm doing is rational. I will tell them that and the calm with which you said that shows that you long and go left the straight jacket because people in the straight jacket explode at each other because they're so repressed. There's so much pain. And if they're going to tolerate that pain then by God so is everyone else.. Why did I get a lot of that as a Mormon woman? Well, it's interesting to think about like, what are the spectrum of acceptable? Because for, and I still have this experience where I get checked or my mind will be like, I don't know that, you know, this particular behavior in this particular situation is the right choice. You may be rubbing people the wrong way,

but depending on the environment that you grew up with,

like I grew up in a kosher home,

eating non- kosher food in the home

...