Thank you for listening to the Allender Center podcast.

I'm Dr. Dan Allender.

And I'm Rachel Clinton-Centen.

We're fiercely committed to providing hope and healing to a fragmented world.

And restoration for the heart.

Thank you for joining us.

Let's get this conversation started.

Thank you for joining us. Let's get this conversation started. Thank you for joining us. This week, we are very privileged and honored to have two guests joining the Allender Center podcast. So this week on the podcast, my friend and colleague, you should be familiar with Mr. Wendell-Moss,

will be hosting the podcast.

He's one of our core teaching staff here at the Allender Center.

You've heard from him on this very podcast and certainly throughout many of our offerings.

He is also currently the manager of intercultural relations for the Seattle School, our home.

And he will be joined today by

special guest, Reverend Dr. Brenda Sulture McNeil, who we have been wanting to have on the podcast

for a while. She is doing incredible work on racial reconciliation. She has for many decades.

She is internationally recognized for her work.

She's an associate professor of Reconciliation Studies at Seattle Pacific University and is also the associate pastor of preaching and reconciliation at Quest Church in Seattle.

One thing that's really special is that Wendell and Dr. Soltram McNeill have known each other for many years as they met in ministry together

over 20 years ago. So Dr. Soltram McNeill has recently, her book has come out, becoming brave.

It's one of several books she's written, and it talks a lot about her own journey of coming

to new conclusions, different conclusions about what the

goal of reconciliation work is. So they're going to have a very robust conversation about their

...