Rainbows and unicorns aren't most people's life. Everybody listening to this, their whole life

can change with a phone call today. And so I want to set you up to be able to love Jesus and

trust Jesus well through that. And I don't serve anyone well if I'm wearing a cape. I'm going to be

very honest about my own doubts, my own struggles. And I've found that that has created a church over a quarter century that is honest,

always grimy, and has some of the more beautiful stories of redemption ever.

Hey, friends, welcome back to another episode of Theology.

Rob, my guest today is Matt Chandler, who serves as a lead pastor at the village church in

Flower Mountain, Texas, and he's the author of several books, including his most recent book,

Becoming Like Jesus, the Everyday Journey to Living a Life of Holiness.

We dig into the book a bit in this conversation. And Matt also

shares very honestly about some of the highs and some of the lows in his life and ministry

over the last few decades. Really enjoyed this conversation with Matt, love his honesty and

his humility. And I think you'll really appreciate this very honest conversation.

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Truly means the world to me and my team.

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So thank you for that.

Okay, please welcome back to the show.

The one or only Matt Chandler.

Oh, man, Matt Chandler. It's good to see you, man. How are you doing? Man, it's been too long, brother. I mean, it was like I had a window with you for a while. And then over the last couple of years, it seems like we haven't had as much time together. And now that you're not, doesn't seem like you're on social media at all. I'm not on a lot. I don't like go search it for stuff, but in the times that I do go online, I don't see Matt Chandler. Are you done with social media? No, no, no. I'm on. I'm just, yeah, for the first time, I'm having someone else run that for me. So I'm not, I'm not as active it. It's not good for me. Not good for my brain, not good for my soul.

Is it good for anybody? Well, I don't know. Some people would argue it very much is a tool that I want to leverage to herald what's good, true, and beautiful. But man, there's a lot wrapped up in it. There are some friends I've met over the years where they remind me like, you know, when you first met? I'm like, I can't remember. It was a Twitter interaction in 2015 or something, and now they're good friends of mine. But that, I think that was an older era when there was some better faith interaction. And now it's just it's kind of. Yeah was just actually preston having a conversation you remember when james macdonald was doing the elephant room yeah

...