This is John Batchelor, conversation with Professor Tyler Ann Binder, his new book,

Plentiful Country, The Great Potato Famine in the Making of Irish New York.

The professor very carefully explains why it is that he was able to put this

enormous piece of research together from banking records, the Emmagrin Savings Bank in

New York. Poor people, bank accounts? In the 21st century

that seems an odd combination. The professor explains why it was necessary in the 19th century.

Professor Anne Binder, the migrants to New York

from Ireland fleeing the potato famine

and the deprivations suffered accordingly. the of years, telling the story of the rise and success of Irish Americans.

More of this tonight.

Exactly.

That's the kind of thing that a lot of people who look at my book don't understand they think oh well only rich people would have

opened bank accounts but in fact it was the opposite because tenement apartments the

tenement building you lived in had no lock on the front door your tenement apartment had no lock on the front door. Your tenement apartment had no lock on the door. So anybody

could waltz into your building and into your apartment if you weren't there. And very often

from the Irish, everybody was out during the day working. And so as a result, and fire was also such a common threat.

And so it's actually the poorest New Yorkers who are more likely to open bank accounts than more well to do New Yorkers who could afford to put a safe in their house or could afford to put a lock on their doors or had servants in their house day and night who could make sure no strangers walked in.

So that's kind of a myth that I've had to disabuse people of in this book.

It's actually the poorer people who are more likely to have bank accounts.