This is John Batchel, a conversation with colleague Bill Whalen of the Hoover Institution about rating president since Lincoln.

The surprise here is that John F. Kennedy, who was briefly president before his tragedy,

rates at number 10, well above other prominent names. Number 10, Bill explains as best we can.

Nostalgia.

Bill Whalen.

Number 10 for John Kennedy left us too early.

More of this about the ratings of presidents,

and you'll be surprised where Joe Biden is tonight.

Kennedy is just beloved by historians.

Kennedy courted historians when he was president.

He had Arthur Schlesiger as his court historian, watching Camelot unfold.

Kennedy is, of course, martyred.

Kennedy is handsome.

Kennedy is etched into stone, and we don't know what would have happened with Kennedy in terms of dealing with civil rights in terms of Vietnam escalation.

So instead, we look at Kennedy heroically. We look at him dealing with the Cuban missile crisis. We look at him giving a speech on civil rights.

We look at the promise of the new frontier. So he's in 10th place, but it's almost a nostalgic 10th place, if you will, John.