Hi, everybody. Welcome back to the Be There in Five podcast. I'm Kate Kennedy, your host. As I record this, it's not even 48 hours since Taylor Swift released her 11th album, The Tortured Poets

Department. And as always, every bait and switch is a work of art. Because not only did most

of us totally misread the concept of this album as just being a heartbreaking post-mortem about Joe.

We also, like, should have known that, of course, during the brief time, she was single, you know, in the past seven years, she was going to write a double album. I mean,

we've literally guessed every other album leading up to this would be like a double album. Never

happens. Sure enough. We have a 2 a.m. surprise. 15 more songs. Fifteen. There's 31 songs in total. 13 in reverse, obviously. I wasn't going to talk about

the album yet this week, especially because my sister and I did a four-part reaction video on

Patreon, so that feels like plenty of commentary coming from me. But part of me was like, well,

this is what we're all thinking about. And more importantly, this is what a lot of us aren't sure what we think about.

You know, like, and that's okay too.

I also think, like, this is just such a vast album in terms of the topics covered,

the spectrum of devastation to joy, the use of like injections of humor that

we haven't had before, just the sheer volume of songs. And while I feel like I can't provide

a quick take or like a singular viewpoint of I love it. I hate it. It's good. It's bad. It's meant to be what it's supposed to be. And if there was ever an album that was not pandering to her audience, it's this one. Like, I think this was made for her. And I think like we should keep that in mind as we talk about it because I think it's perfect as is because I think it is so distinct. It's clear that this is what she really

wanted to make. And whether it was cathartic or experimental or she kind of was interested in taking

her image down a notch because her resentment of her good reputation is just as stark here as

she once felt, you know, completely distraught by her bad reputation.

The image she's upholding now seems to be the thing that's most in her way. And yeah, I mean,

there's just so much here. But the volume of songs, the response to that is interesting.

And maybe this is the creator in me that also likes to give people more than less and feels super because some people

complain about it. I've been fascinated by some of the formal reviews. Like, Atlantic said she,

you know, has a quality control issue and then New York Times said she needs an editor. And I think

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