And we turn now to our PBS video podcast, Settle In.

For our latest episode, I spoke to pioneering digital forensic expert,

Hani Fareed.

We talked about why disinformation spreads online, how to find reliable sources of information,

and why he's still hopeful about our digital future.

The thing you have to understand about social media is not only is it doesn't care about real,

fake, true lies. In fact, it actually prefers algorithmically the spread of mis and disinformation

because that's what leads to user engagement. So the algorithms have learned how to spread the most salacious, outrageous,

conspiratorial content because that's what the billions of people online click on. And so in many

ways, we've known this for a long time, is that the Y spread much, much faster than the truth,

which of course adds a whole other complexity to the speed with which we have to respond and also

the consequences for getting it wrong. I mean, you just said something fascinating, though.

It's not just that people are spreading these things because they do. It's not a coincidence.

Ragebate was the word of the year last year, right? But it's that the algorithms actually prefer

them over real information or real images. Is that right?

That's 100% right. And the reason, of course, is because the business model of social media,

think X, Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, etc. is user engagement. The more you click, the more ads we

deliver, the more money they make. And so the algorithms, they didn't set out to burn the

place to the ground. They didn't set out to do that. It was learned. And, you know, you could blame

the social media giants for this, and I think we should. But at the end of the day, we're the ones

clicking on those posts. We are the ones teaching the machines that this is what we will engage

with.

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