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The Dishcast with Andrew Sullivan

Nellie Bowles On Ditching Wokeness

The Dishcast with Andrew Sullivan

Andrew Sullivan

Politics, News, Religion & Spirituality

4.6836 Ratings

🗓️ 14 June 2024

⏱️ 58 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit andrewsullivan.substack.com

Nellie is a writer and reporter. She has worked for many mainstream publications, most notably the NYT covering Silicon Valley. Now she is teamed up with her wife, Bari Weiss, to run The Free Press — a media company they launched on Substack in 2021. Nellie’s weekly news roundup, TGIF, is smart and hilarious, and so is her new book, Morning After the Revolution: Dispatches From the Wrong Side of History.

For two clips of our convo — on the scourge of Slack, and questioning whether trans is immutable — pop over to our YouTube page. Other topics: Nellie growing up in SF with divorced parents; her mother the writer and stockbroker; her dad the entrepreneur; Nellie the tomboy who ran the gay-straight alliance to find a girlfriend; reading conservatives (Paglia, Rand, Coulter) as a liberal teen; working at the SF Chronicle; the NYT full of “intense, ambitious people on a political mission”; James Bennet; Dean Baquet and the “racial reckoning”; the 1619 Project; Donald McNeil; the MSM ignoring antifa; Joe Kahn taking a stand; NPR refusing to cover Hunter’s laptop; lab-leak theory; disinfo as a “useful cudgel”; CHAZ/CHOP in Seattle; Prager U; the Shitty Media Men list; Jordan Peterson and “enforced monogamy”; James Damore; a NYT editor calling Bari “a f*****g Nazi”; Nellie falling in love with her; losing friends over their relationship; Nellie being very pregnant right now; male role models for the kids of lesbians; marriage equality; the queer left’s opposition to marriage; when the straights culturally appropriate “queer”; Ptown and Dina Martina; the importance of Pride for small towns; taking my mum to a parade; the US being way behind Europe on trans kids; the profound effects of hormones; the “the science is settled” campaign by GLAAD; detransitioners; Jan 6 and Stop the Steal; right-wing pressure on courts and Congress due to Trump; RFK Jr’s candidacy; the woke blackout on humor; Elon Musk; the mainstreaming of masks and violent rhetoric after Oct 7; Nellie converting to Judaism; and how her book is “not about heroism.”

Browse the Dishcast archive for an episode you might enjoy (the first 102 are free in their entirety — subscribe to get everything else). Coming up: Lionel Shriver on her new novel, Tim Shipman on the UK elections, Elizabeth Corey on Oakeshott, Erick Erickson on the left’s spiritual crisis, Bill Wasik and Monica Murphy on animal cruelty, Van Jones, and Stephen Fry! Please send any guest recs, dissents, and other comments to [email protected].

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

The

0:07.0

The Hi, everybody.

0:29.6

I sound like Dr. Nick.

0:31.6

Hi, everybody.

0:33.3

Does you have a Dr. Nick on The Simpsons?

0:35.0

Anyway, hello, everyone.

0:37.4

This is the weekly dish, dishcast, your favorite podcast.

0:43.1

I can't tell you how shocking it is to me sometimes to read emails from you about how connected

0:50.7

you out of this hour and a half.

0:52.4

And I think there's something about the intimacy of

0:56.9

this medium that generates some of that and I'm super thrilled that you like the conversations

1:04.7

we've been having and and I'm also grateful for all the tips and in other words all the shut up

1:10.2

so the notes we get

1:11.8

sometimes, which I totally understand and I do my best.

1:16.0

I'm having terrible trouble toilet training Truman, but and that has just been a huge blow

1:20.9

in my life.

1:21.6

And for some reason, I've never really been good with dogs and toilet training.

1:25.9

Now, before I put it down to the fact I had three beagles or hound dogs in a row,

1:31.3

and they're notoriously bad at it.

1:34.4

But I really thought I was going to do better this time, and I really do everything they tell

1:37.8

you to do, and I don't know what's going on.

1:39.3

Anyway, I may have to go see a doggy trainer or somebody in Provincetown.

...

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