Welcome to the global phenomenon, Surviving the Survivor, where we bring you the best guests in all of true crime.

Here's your host, Emmy Award winning journalist Joel Waldman.

What's up, SCS Nation?

Welcome to Survive and Survivor.

It is the podcast that promises to bring you the very best guests in all of true crime on trending criminal cases like the Menendez brothers.

We are talking about a case that is making headlines all over the United States and the world.

And it's been doing that for the better part of almost four decades.

And you all are in for a big treat tonight because you're about

to meet Robert Rand and Stephen Gazzaris. But Robert Rand has been on this case.

There's not a lot of people that can say this. As a matter of fact, I think he is the only person

who can say this. He's been covering this since, I think, literally the day after the murders.

Back in 1989, Robert Rand is an Emmy and DuPont Columbia Award-winning journalist. He began,

as I said, covering this the day after the murder back on August 20th, 1989 was the day of

the killing.

He is the only reporter who's covered the investigation since the fall of 89.

He was in court daily for each six-month-long Menendez trial in 93 to 94 and 95 to 96, literally there every single day. He provided an analysis for court TV, CNN, ABC News, CBS News, and he spent three days interviewing Eric and Lyle Menendez two months after the murder and five months before their March 1990 arrest.

And he's seen them many times before.

He's also co-executive producer of Menendez and Minuto boys betrayed.

And we've got a clip of that.

And that is kind of what fueled this habeas corpus motion that will have Stephen

Cazars explain to us what that is all about. And he also has a book,

Robert Rand. He's done it all. He is the go-to guy on Menendez brothers. And there it is,

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