Meet Britain’s most charming ‘national security threat’
The Story
The Times
3.9 • 1.6K Ratings
🗓️ 19 November 2025
⏱️ 34 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
In an attempt to court the favour of the post-Assad regime in Syria, western countries have recently de-proscribed former terrorist groups. What does that mean for those who were deprived of their citizenship for allegedly associating with those groups, back when the West banned them?
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Guest: Anthony Loyd, special correspondent, The Times.
Host: Manveen Rana.
Producer: Taryn Siegel.
Read more: Rabies, Russians and a return to scene of my kidnap, 11 years ago.
Further listening: Palmyra: Syria's past, present and future.
Clips: The Guardian, CNN, The Times, France 24.
Photo: Anthony Loyd for The Times.
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | From The Times and the Sunday Times, this is the story. |
| 0:08.6 | I'm Manvina. |
| 0:13.4 | For years, amid the bloody backdrop of the Syrian Civil War, |
| 0:20.3 | his was a name to be reckoned with, |
| 0:23.6 | Abu Muhammad Al-Jolani, a Syrian rebel and Islamist militant, he commanded a group that used to be the local branch of Al-Qaeda. |
| 0:33.9 | He and his militia were prescribed as terrorists in the West, and the US even placed a $10 million bounty on his head. |
| 0:45.8 | Fast forward a few years, and this former jihadi commander is now the president of Syria, a Syria that has risen from the ashes of the brutal Assad regime. |
| 1:03.9 | This victory, my brothers, is a victory for the entire Islamic nation. This new triumph, my brothers, |
| 1:13.6 | marks a new chapter in the history of the region. Now, Al Jalani, as he was known then, has swapped his nondagir for his real name, Ahmed al-Sharrar. |
| 1:21.6 | And his military fatigues are gone, replaced by a sharp suit and tie. |
| 1:26.6 | Last week, he was even welcomed to the White House, |
| 1:30.3 | the first Syrian leader in history to be invited. |
| 1:35.3 | He's a very strong leader. |
| 1:37.3 | He comes from a very tough place, and he's a tough guy. |
| 1:42.3 | People said he's had a tough guy. |
| 1:46.1 | People said he's had a rough past. |
| 1:47.6 | We all had rough pasts. |
| 1:49.5 | But he has had a rough past. |
| 1:51.6 | And I think, frankly, if you didn't have a rough pass, |
| 1:52.5 | you wouldn't have a chance. |
| 2:05.7 | But as the West courts former terrorists in order to befriend this new Syria, what does that mean for others who were caught up in the crossfire? |
| 2:09.3 | The Times special correspondent Anthony Lloyd has been back to Syria, meeting a man who |
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