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She tried hard to keep convicted felons in prison in ways that alienated some left-wing people

who felt that she tried too hard, you know, that she pulled out too many stops on these kind of things.

And the best thing, the easiest thing for her to say is that like she is aware of the problems of the far left in the United States of America,

that she has actually taken that on in key respects.

And I think frankly that as a black woman she is not going to be bullied

by some of the people who may be able to get over on a Joe Biden or a

McDonaldin or some of the other people in his circle there that

she has a greater level of comfort with coming out and saying, you know, like her parents are immigrated to this country right and there's a great immigrant patriotism story to tell about that right that like the they did not come naive about some of the problems with the United States of America,

but they felt it was the greatest land of opportunity that raised their daughter there, etc,

that you know, she put criminals in prison because some criminals need to be in

prison I think her 2009 book about this called Smart on Crime is actually quite

good you know and just reflects a different

period in American politics than her 2019 campaign. And now the good fight

with Yasha Monck.

My guest today is Matt Iglesias. Matt is a co-founder of Vox who now has one of the biggest subtext called

slow boring not because it is boring but because he is invoking Max Weber's

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