Marc Lipsitch on Playing Pandemic Roulette in the Lab
The Good Fight
Yascha Mounk
4.7 • 963 Ratings
🗓️ 19 May 2026
⏱️ 69 minutes
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| 0:00.0 | Some follow the noise. |
| 0:03.0 | Bloomberg follows the money, whether it's the funds fueling AI or crypto's trillion-dollar swings. |
| 0:08.9 | There's a money-side to every story. |
| 0:11.4 | Get the money-side of the story. |
| 0:13.5 | Subscribe now at Bloomberg.com. |
| 0:18.1 | So most things have not gone very far, but they do illustrate that infections happen. |
| 0:24.4 | Transmission can happen as it did with SARS, with one of the SARS releases by mistake in the mid-2000s. |
| 0:31.9 | So it is a real risk. |
| 0:36.0 | And now the Good Fight with Yasha Monk. |
| 0:44.8 | Around the world, there have been, and to some extent still are a lot of labs that engage in gain-off function research. |
| 0:52.0 | What that means is that they take a pathogen and they try to find |
| 0:55.1 | all the ways in which it could be more dangerous. Now, the purpose of this is to make sure |
| 1:00.1 | that we are prepared for all kinds of possibilities that we can prevent terrible pandemics in |
| 1:05.3 | the future. But there's also an obvious risk. What if one of these pathogens that leaks from |
| 1:09.2 | the lab? What if somebody working in those labs |
| 1:11.5 | learns how to do them and replicates it for nefarious purposes of the own? There's all kinds of |
| 1:19.1 | things that could go wrong. Arguably, that is what did go wrong at the beginning of the COVID |
| 1:24.4 | pandemic. So should we ban gain of function research? Well, today I invited into my |
| 1:31.7 | podcast somebody who has argued that we should at the very least be much, much more cautious |
| 1:36.6 | about gain of function research than we are. And he is a very senior figure in the field of |
| 1:42.6 | public health. Mark Lipsich has taught at Harvard for a long time, |
| 1:46.0 | just joined the Stanford faculty, |
... |
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