Welcome. I'm Kevin Miller. I have conversations with people that help us make better meaning of our lives. In this episode, living and thriving with pain of loss that will never go away. The concept of trauma has gotten more focused than ever as of late it seems, but I feel much of what gets labeled trauma is the pain of loss.

Losses we don't know how to or maybe never will reconcile.

I don't necessarily claim having traumas in my life, just as how I see it, how I define it.

But I have loss, significant loss

that I don't think I'll ever get over. I don't want to minimize trauma at all, but I feel even

more people resonate with the concept of loss, even if it stems ultimately or initially

from a tragic trauma. And what I've been considering is that some of the

losses I don't really expect or even intend to get over. They're now a part of me. And I want to

thrive in my life anyway and amongst them. So my guest knows much about this, not only from

his own life, but with experience with so,

so many people. So Lee Warren, he's a neurosurgeon. Every day he's dealing with people who may

lose some of their cognitive abilities or their lives. And he deals, of course, with their loved

ones who are losing someone significant in their lives. And he deals, of course, with their loved ones who are losing someone significant in their

lives. This is just Lee's daily life. And in addition, Lee knows what I'm going to call

straight up big T trauma. Listen to this. On August 20, 2013, his 19-year-old son, Mitch, died of multiple stab wounds to the neck.

Mitch's best friend died along with him with one stab wound. Whether the knife used to kill Mitch was

in his hand or someone else's, whether he was at fault or a victim,

they'll never know. It's an unsolved murder. This could have been the end of Lee. Well, obviously,

it's not. Doesn't mean he hasn't gotten over it, though, or that he expects to to all this adds up to what i found to be a

profound conversation that i continue to understand even more as time passes and i experience more

loss in my own life lea has a book about all this it's called hope Hope is the First Dose, a treatment plan for recovering

from trauma, tragedy, and other massive things. And wherever you're listening to the podcast here,

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