All right, welcome listeners to episode 130 of Know Your Enemy.

I'm Matt Sitman, your podcast co-host, and I'm here as always with my great friend,

Sam other bell.

Hey, Sam.

Hi, Matt.

This is a very, I would say, unique and interesting episode.

Yeah.

We head on Peter Gonzalez, who, well, I think it'd be fair to describe him as ex-Maga. He left

MAGA behind. And that's a rare person to have a public conversation with. Yeah, and not only was,

you know, Pedro, a true believing MAGA supporter. He was a longtime pundit and personality on

the new right. He wrote for, you know, many of the

outlets we talk about on this show, American Greatness, The Daily Caller, Chronicles, Washington

Examiner, certainly all the Claremont publications, as you'll hear. So Pedro was fully a made man of the

new right and has defected. And this conversation

is just super interesting because we hear step by step about his career, how he got into

right-wing politics, and the process of his disillusionment. Yes. Another interesting thing

about Pedro is that he kind of entered the new right via paleo

conservatism. So he gave us an insight into a little different corner of the conservative

movement than, say, when I was a young conservative, the kinds of organizations and publications

I gravitated toward. Yeah, he was turned on by Sam Francis and Pat Buchanan,

so a different path than you. I did want to say that, like, I'm sure some listeners will be

kind of listening closely to this conversation to hear whether Pedro seems sufficiently

...