And all my whatever career, I've said that social change cannot happen until somebody's willing to take a risk.

And I believe that.

And I believe it's going to get scarier and scarier to take a risk.

Hi, everyone, and welcome to the Best People podcast. Unfortunately for us, Best People doesn't

begin to capture this week's guest because she's more than that. She's an icon known the world

over. Her lyrics are literally the words that have accompanied everything

we associate in our country's history with justice and change and all things good. But she's

part of our present moment as well. This week's guest on the Best People podcast is Joan Baez.

Thank you so much for being here. It's an honor. Thank you so much for having me.

I love everything you've done, but I especially love everything you've said about this moment.

And one thing that I changed immediately is I am never going to call anything unprecedented again.

You stopped me in my tracks when I read that.

And I want to go back and take that word out of everything I've ever said about this administration.

Will you explain, though, why that is no good?

Unprecedented?

Well, because that group of people would love to be unprecedented.

I mean, at every turn, that's a next wave of horrors is unprecedented. So get used to it and drop the word. We shouldn't be surprised by it anymore.

Yeah, there's this piece of the Trump story that we as journalists still don't know how to tell. And it's this

openness. I think we have to new information when there are no new Trump stories. It's corruption.

Right? I mean, it's, and it's so it's, it's so it's on us, but I wonder being on the front lines with people fighting for justice and for freedom, what it feels like to watch the country do this again.

Well, I was thinking of writing.

It was the worst of times, and it was the worst of times.

...