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I began to start to think about what poverty actually is,

and that it is not just about wealth. Poverty is about a lack of dignity. It is about a lack of

choice, about a lack of opportunity, it's a lack of visibility. This is Design Matters with Debbie Millman.

For 16 years, Debbie has been talking with creative people about what they do, how they

got to be who they are, and what they're thinking about and working on.

On this episode, Jacqueline Novogratz talks about her long career fighting poverty around the world.

Now I feel like I have failed so many times. I just feel it's another step on the road to success.

Here's Debbie, first with a couple of messages,

then her interview with Jocklin Novograt's.

I'm a native New Yorker, but since the beginning of the pandemic,

I've been living in Los Angeles.

I miss my hometown, but I love having more space, more sun, and a big garden.

...