From New York Times opinion, I'm Ross Douthat, and this is interesting times. Since the attacks of October 7th, Israel has dealt serious blows to its enemies, to Hamas,

to Hezbollah, and to Iran. It has pursued a war in Gaza, a war with a civilian death toll

in the tens of thousands that

has no certain endgame.

And Israel has also lost a lot of public support in the United States, in the Democratic Party,

especially but also on the political right.

All these unfinished stories matter, not just for Israel's future, but for American politics and culture.

But which one matters most?

Are Israel's strategic successes clearing the way for Middle Eastern peace?

Is the Gaza War locking in anti-Israel sentiment, carrying anti-Semitism in its train?

To argue through these questions, I'm joined

by my colleague Brett Stevens, who writes eloquently about the Middle East and the threat

of anti-Semitism. Brett Stevens, welcome to interesting times. It's good to be here, awesome.

So we're having this conversation on the afternoon of the day when Prime Minister

Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel is scheduled to be at the White House meeting with President

Donald Trump, presumably talking about Iran, talking about the prospects for a ceasefire in Gaza. And ultimately, I want this to be a

conversation not just about the Middle East, but about America and the effect of wars in the

Middle East on American culture and politics. But let's start with the war in Gaza. I think it's

been hard for a while, for me at least, to see what the

actual endgame is in Gaza. It's been hard in certain ways since the first days of the war.

And I want to talk about that endgame, but first I just want your overall assessment of

whether the Gaza war at this moment seems to have been worth it to Israel

...