So here's the part at the top of the show where I sometimes mention something about the content of the episode, suicide, for instance, and I try to indicate whether it's going to be mentioned in passing or it gets into detail.

And I do that because I want you to feel safe listening. I don't want there to be a

shocking jolt that connects you to traumatic events or disturbing thoughts and takes you out

of the flow of what we're talking about. Now, not everyone offers these warnings, mind you.

I'm always watching movies or TV shows where suicide comes up unexpectedly,

where someone is in a position that my brother was in when he died, and it sucks when I see that,

and I'm not expecting it, that sudden diversion. I'd rather prepare you so you can stay with

the conversation that we're having.

All that said, consider this one big note to listeners this week.

We're going to talk about suicide openly, bluntly, for pretty much the whole interview,

and we're doing it in order to fight suicide.

We'll avoid talking about methods, of course that's just good practice.

But listen, suicide is real.

It's a threat, and like a lot of mental health issues, if we can face it, if we can lock eyes with it and not back down,

we take away some of its power. We demystify it.

Like, never talking about cancer would be bad policy, right? Cancer kills people. Let's try to learn

about it and what we can do to stop it. Car accidents kill a lot of people too. Should we avoid ever discussing car safety? No, of course not. We should talk about it. Car accidents kill a lot of people, too. Should we avoid ever discussing car safety?

No, of course not. We should talk about it a lot. Let's have a lot of conversations. And let's do that

with suicide, too, in the interest of safety. I have just the person. It's depression mode. I'm John Moe. I'm so glad you're here.

A couple weeks ago we had A.J. Delario on the show, and he talked about his suicidal moments,

including a very recent one. And he said in that moment, he called Clancy Martin. That made me

want to hear from Clancy, too. So that's who's on this week. Clancy Martin is a remarkable person,

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