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Learning How to See with Brian McLaren

Include and Transcend (feat. Barbara Brown Taylor)

Learning How to See with Brian McLaren

Center for Action and Contemplation

Christianity, Religion & Spirituality

4.8748 Ratings

🗓️ 3 February 2023

⏱️ 32 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

How have you experienced the grief of growth?   In this episode, Barbara Brown Taylor joins Brian for a stimulating conversation about the importance of emotional honesty on each step of our spiritual journey. As we outgrow religious ideas and practices, it’s tempting to bend the truth to make us comfortable—but that reaction slows the process of transformation.  Resources: The transcript for this episode can be found here. Throughout this season, as questions or thoughts arise, we'd love to hear from you. You can contact us by leaving a voicemail or emailing us at podcasts@cac.org

Transcript

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0:00.0

About 40 years ago, I became interested in theories of human development with their various stage models.

0:11.0

Over the decades, I've studied well over a dozen models that try to describe general patterns in the way humans grow.

0:20.0

I've seen with increasing clarity how spiritual development describe general patterns in the way humans grow.

0:27.9

I've seen with increasing clarity how spiritual development is affected by each new stage of our human development.

0:30.7

The reverse is also true.

0:32.9

Our growth or lack of growth in spirituality inhibits or unleashes our cognitive relational and emotional

0:41.8

growth. Their relationship is reciprocal. How could it be otherwise? Whether or not you choose

0:51.7

to stay Christian, here's what I recommend. Pay attention to your human development,

0:59.2

to the stages you're entering, inhabiting, or leaving. If you're ready to grow to a new stage,

1:07.7

but your current form of Christianity keeps you from doing so.

1:11.9

You're going to be frustrated, and rightly so.

1:15.5

You may let your current beliefs and practices trap you, so you stagnate or even regress.

1:23.7

That sense of stagnation or stuckness may eventually drive you to leave Christianity entirely,

1:31.1

seeking room to grow elsewhere.

1:33.5

That's certainly understandable.

1:36.8

But you have another option, too.

1:39.5

You can leave your current form or stage of Christianity and enter a new form or stage that allows and

1:47.7

even encourages the growth that you desire and need. A lot of people leave Christianity when really

1:55.4

all they needed was to leave a confining form or stage of Christianity. Some people think leaving Christianity

2:04.1

will solve their problems, not realizing that their problems are as rooted in their stage

2:09.6

of development as in their religion. The reverse is also true. Some atheists, agnostics, or people

2:16.7

of other religions become Christians because

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