Welcome to Back from the Abyss. I'm Dr. Craig Hecock.

We have something really special here today, and I'm so excited to share

this with all of you. Three of the five most downloaded episodes of Back from the Abyss have

featured either Saarrafi or Hilary McBride, and both of them join us today to share a totally

fascinating session recording of Hillary doing trauma

work with Saj. But first, with so much joy, I would like to announce a training that I'm doing

with Hillary this spring. We will be leading an experiential intensive workshop on transference

and countertransference called, I love you, I hate you, are you my mom?

This will take place in Victoria, British Columbia, May 28th to 30th. I'll have a link in the show

notes for more information and registration. This will be for mental health clinicians only.

There are just 20 spots, so don't dally if you want to come. I think this is going to be

a really special gathering. And as an Enegram 7, I'm already counting down the days. Okay, back to today's

story. What you're about to hear is extraordinary, easily one of the most compelling and fascinating things we've featured

on the podcast, an in-depth, in-the-room exploration of the moment-to-moment unfolding of a psychedelic

assisted trauma session. During her training to work with Saj's psychedelic somatic model

called P-Sip, Hillary did a profound session with Saj, which led to some very unexpected gifts for her.

Interestingly, the psychedelic used for this session was THC.

Now, Saj has spoken extensively and passed back from the Abyss episodes

why he considers Vap THC to be a particularly potent catalyst for somatic trauma work,

to rapidly cut through dissociation and heightened autonomic reactions.

First, we'll hear Saj give us some background context in an introduction to the theory of his

work. Then we'll hear Hillary enter into a very emotional and often physically grueling session,

...