What to Make of a Life is the new book from Jim Collins, best-selling author of Good to Great.

Based on 10 years of research, What to Make of a Life offers transformative teachings on what it takes to navigate your way through periods of fog,

make it past life's inevitable cliffs, and keep the inner fire burning bright, long, and late.

Step into frame with What to Make of a Life, the Instant New York Times bestseller by Jim

Collins, available from Harper Edge wherever books are sold.

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Derek Thompson, welcome to the show. Hey, great to be here. Derek was a longtime staff writer at The Atlantic, and he's the co-author, most recently, of the, at this point, super-duper mega bestseller abundance.

He's now the author of a relentlessly interesting substack, which you should check out.

And it is on that substack that he wrote

a lovely reflection on fatherhood, which is what we're going to talk about today. So,

fatherhood, Derek, overrated or underrated? Well, certainly rated. Everyone has something to say about

...