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I spoke with Madeline Olbright, the first woman to serve as Secretary of State.

We discussed her new book, Hell and Other Destinations and the Global Pandemic.

Check it out.

Madam Secretary, welcome to the Daily Social Licensing Show.

I'm delighted to be with you, but thanks for asking me.

Of course.

Anytime you always welcome as a guest, before we get into the interview, I know that you

have one of the most impressive brooch collections and they all mean something.

So I'm assuming that V on your lapel stands for something?

Because I spent the war in England, World War II, and my father broadcast for BBC.

I listen to BBC every night.

And they, with cattle drums, would do the first five notes of Beethoven's fifth, Dada

Dada, which in Morse code is V for victory.

As somebody who grew up and lived through a war, you know, you had to do things like you

had to wear masks as a child.

You had government imposed lockdowns that you and your family had to adhere to.

Was there a different sentiment than there is now in terms of listening to the government

and doing what is best for the population at large?

Well, I was a little girl and I did what I was told, but I really do think that what

was similar, and I'd love to talk about this a bit, is that the people had no control

...