Welcome back to You Have Permission, the show that aims to take both Christianity and the modern world of science and culture very seriously.

My name is Dan Koch. I'm a licensed therapist and a post-evangelical liberal Protestant. And I, too, like my guests today, am milkless. I am a dad. I got nothing to give them

when those kids are really just in need of some comfort. I just don't have the goods like my wife has.

That's Matt and Max from the Milkless podcast who are here to do one of these I don't believe in

that God episodes which I will briefly describe in a minute but Matt and Max hosts of the

milkless podcast which I love thanks for being here. Hey thanks for having us man. Yeah super pumped

pumped to be here and yeah like we just recorded with you releasing these the same day.

It's kind of like Terminator 2. You know, you don't need to see the first one. Right. But,

you want to see the first one. Yeah. You want to see them. I mean, yeah. This is a both feeds,

dual episode situation here. We just recorded an episode of Milkless,

where I was the guest talking about mostly the benefits, but some of the costs of

spirituality and religion, especially with children, because Matt and Max, their show,

Milclis is focused a lot on parenting from basically a dad perspective. I really enjoy it.

I would highly recommend their show. And if you're interested in sort of doing the whole thing,

then I would say listen to that one first. We will probably build a little bit on that conversation,

but we will be sure to explain anything that needs explaining. You don't have to listen to it. Like Max said, you don't have to watch Terminator. You can just jump straight to the

best action film of all time, T2. Listen, we're starting naked in the middle of a parking lot.

In media res. That's what we want. Media res. That's what we want. That's what we want.

Classes. So we're these, these episodes, I haven't done as much of them recently as I like to. I'm going to kind of redouble my efforts to do some more of these. I don't believe in that God episodes. Basically, it's a chance for me to talk to people who are, you know, broadly speaking, less religious than I am or less spiritual or whatever and talk about like hear their

stories and kick around some ideas and see where we differ and where we actually agree.

We did a little bit of that on the milkless episode.

We kind of got into that.

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