How To Work With Shame with Dr. Laurence Heller

The Trauma Therapist

Guy Crawford Macpherson

Education, Alternative Health, Self-improvement, Health & Fitness, Mental Health

4.5 • 579 Ratings

🗓️ 26 February 2026

⏱️ 31 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Dr. Laurence Heller is a clinical psychologist, international trainer, and author with over four decades of experience in the field of trauma healing. He is the creator of the NeuroAffective Relational Model® (NARM®), a clinical approach specifically designed for working with complex and developmental trauma.

Dr. Heller holds a Ph.D. in Clinical Psychology and, after years of working with treatment modalities such as Gestalt, Somatic Experiencing®, and psychodynamic psychotherapy, recognized a significant gap in models addressing early developmental trauma. It was out of this recognition—and the growing need in the field—that he developed NARM.He is the founder and director of the NARM Training Institute and a Senior Fellow at The Meadows Treatment Centers.

Dr. Heller regularly teaches advanced NARM trainings across the U.S. and Europe, leads immersive clinical consultations, and is a sought-after speaker at trauma-focused conferences worldwide. His groundbreaking book Healing Developmental Trauma, co-authored with Aline LaPierre, has been translated into 15 languages. His more recent book, The Practical Guide for Healing Developmental Trauma, was published in 2022 by North Atlantic Books.

In This Episode

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Transcript

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0:00.0	Welcome to the Trauma Therapist podcast. My name is Guy McPherson. I interview incredible people who've dedicated their lives to helping those who've been impacted by trauma. A big thank you to our sponsors and our guests who are supporting this show.
0:14.4	Five, four, three, two, and one. Our folks, welcome back to the podcast. very excited to have back. Dr. Lawrence Heller.
0:23.8	Lawrence, welcome. Good to be here. Thank you. So Dr. Heller is a clinical psychologist, international
0:30.1	trainer, an author with over four decades of experience in the field of trauma healing. He's a
0:35.9	creator of the neuro-effective relational model or norm, a clinical approach specifically
0:42.0	designed for working with complex and developmental trauma.
0:45.7	Dr. Heller, hold the PhD in clinical psychology, and after years of working with treatment
0:49.8	modalities such as Gestalt, somatic experiencing, and psychodynamic psychotherapy, recognize a significant
0:56.7	gap in models addressing early developmental trauma. And it was out of this recognition and the
1:02.1	growing need in the field that he developed NARM. All right, Lawrence, just a little bit about you. Before
1:08.1	we get going, share with the listeners where you're from originally and where you are currently.
1:12.5	Well, I was born in Denver, Colorado, and I'm now in Los Angeles. I've spent a significant part of my life also teaching in Europe.
1:23.7	So at one point, I was teaching like almost half time in Europe, but that's scaled
1:29.2	back. So now I'm, I still teach in Europe, but not nearly as much as I once did. So I've kind of
1:34.2	been all over the place in my life. So as we, you have a new book coming out. We're going to
1:40.2	talk about that. But as a segue, in the, in the bio, it said you notice a significant gap in the treatment of trauma.
1:49.5	Talk a little bit about that.
1:51.7	Well, if I could put it into two categories, which is an oversimplification always,
1:56.8	but still, the more psychodynamic orientation, which is more top- kind of the more psychodynamic orientation and the which is more top down
2:04.1	and the more somatically oriented therapies which tends to be bottom up and what I found is that
2:11.1	there were difficulties in both areas things that were really missed And then that was on a very basic level.
2:19.0	I'll elaborate later about maybe some more of the details.
	...

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